sadly may 2021 reports davosagenda has cancelled aug 2021 update from singapore- next stops geneva mountains jan 22? mahbubani syllabus- EconomistDiary.com breaking news jan 2021 - singapores leader shares views at davos agenda and welcomes opportunity to stage entire weforum summit in august
when we surveyed goal 1 end poverty world bankers like jim kim about number 1 educatorof sdg generation he said sir fazle abed; when we asked fazle abed about coalition partners of university coalition he said a consensus among most asian ambassadors was singapore for knowing where to connect with and korea if you want to inspect some innovations humanising ai before you did a grand tour of china's connections such as the schwarzman triad: beijing's tsinghua, boston's mit, oxford's rhodes on number 1 educator /alumni netwrk to learn from he said sir fazle abed; united labs for all human hope and love -in the 2010s more data than humans had ever seen before was created by satellites and mobile devices; moreover 10 dollar computer chips had caught up with the number crunching ability of human brains- and unlike us 7.5 billion people could be cloned to operate specific systems in real time- eg soon driving and policing of cars can be done by the artificials but this begs a question what priority help do 7.5 billion people need? why over 15 years were autnonomous cars priortitised over ending viruses/ the answer is people at the top of the biggest organisations do not see natures challenges to us beings at ground level; the challenge of how to prioritise human ai was popular in the economist of the 1970s partly becuase a journalist had been privilieged to be one of the last people to interview von neumann whose legacy has been 60 years of ai labs started up with twins in 1960 facintg the atlantic out of bostons mit and facing the pacific out of stanford- exercise fingd a globe and point to a place where one thousandth of humans mediates a bigger diversity of demands for humanising tech than anywhere else? did you choose singapore: a island at the apex of the 2 coastlines that 70% of humans being asian depend most on for world trade shipping -while you should certainly choose anywhere on the globe you like to do this survey its extraordinary what can be learnt from singaporeans if 2021 is to be the most exciting and loving year after the hopelessyear of covid 2020 ...
what would happen if every under 30 -and their teachers -knew how to act on knowhow of singapore sustainability leaders -
here are 2 world class curricula, around which emeging applications map -vote for smart singapore youtube libraries 1 rsvp chris.macrae@yahoo.co.uk
Thursday, November 19, 2020
video 1
10.46 wang qiang
ives me great pleasure to attend the
10:31
2021
10:32
new economy forum virtually
10:36
on behalf of the chinese government
10:39
i wish to extend warm congratulations on
10:42
the opening of the
10:51
the international environment is
10:53
undergoing profound changes
10:55
and once in a century pandemic continues
10:57
to
10:58
spread the global economy has shown some
11:01
signs of recovery
11:04
this foundation is not yet solid as
11:06
evidenced by the acute problems of sharp
11:08
fluctuations
11:09
high fragility
11:11
and structural imbalances
11:28
in the face of these shifting
11:29
circumstances
11:31
the communist party of china and the
11:33
chinese government
11:34
have taken into account
11:36
both domestic and international
11:38
environments
11:39
followed a coordinated approach to
11:41
covered response
11:44
and social economic development
11:46
and made some progress embarrassing
11:50
on the domestic front we have grounded
11:52
our efforts in the new development stage
11:54
and applied the new development
11:56
philosophy
11:57
to foster a new development paradigm
12:00
and pursuing
12:01
high quality
12:03
development
12:05
following the general principles seeking
12:06
progress while
12:08
stability
12:09
we ensuring
12:10
on managing our own affairs well
12:12
in response to people's inspiration
12:15
for a better life
12:21
on the external front how much
12:27
[Music]
12:29
to share market opportunities with the
12:31
wider world
12:33
we explicitly observed true
12:36
multilateralism resolutely defended the
12:39
world's common interests
12:41
and push forward
12:45
high quality
12:46
belt and road corporation
12:51
international cooperation against coffee
12:52
19.
12:53
we have honored our commitments and lift
12:56
up to our responsibility
12:58
we can't be making major contributions
13:03
the global fight against the corona
13:05
virus
13:08
last week
13:10
the 19th cpc center committee
13:13
successfully convened a sixth plenary
13:15
session
13:17
the session comprehensively summarized
13:19
the major achievements
13:21
and historical
13:23
appearance of the cpc over the past
13:25
century
13:28
and a quarter pound the entire party
13:30
and all chinese people
13:59
isolation of the world
14:01
and nor can the world develop
14:04
without china
14:06
china will not waver
14:08
and it's resolved to deepen reform and
14:10
expand opening up
14:14
china's development
14:15
is a great cause
14:17
that is part of the progress
14:18
of the entire humanity
14:21
going forward
14:24
china will keep his arms wide open
14:29
investment and the growth opportunities
14:31
to the world
14:34
and contribute
14:36
to the building of an open world economy
14:40
and a community with a shared future
14:42
for mankind
14:58
there are also some new trends and
15:00
opportunities
15:04
we need to be more open-minded
15:07
think more creatively
15:09
and take more programmatic steps
15:13
to jointly create
15:14
a brighter future
15:16
for the world economy
15:20
we need to join hands to fight covenant
15:23
in
15:37
the international community should work
15:38
in concert
15:40
and follow a science-based attitude
15:44
to tackle and defeat the virus
15:47
we need to support each other's response
15:49
efforts
15:51
and strengthen cooperation in monitoring
15:53
tools therapeutic medicines
15:56
and research production
15:58
and mutual recognition of vaccines
16:02
in order to effectively forge
16:04
a synergy against the pandemic
16:08
we need to promote fair
16:10
and equitable distribution of vaccines
16:13
worldwide
16:14
and in particular
16:16
step up support for developing countries
16:20
to ensure
16:34
of science
16:37
firmly oppose
16:38
politicization of issues involving
16:40
vaccines and origins tracing
16:44
and jointly built a global community of
16:46
health
16:58
openness brings progress
17:00
whereas isolation leads to backwardness
17:05
we need to promote trade and investment
17:08
liberalization and facilitation
17:10
bring down trade and knowledge barriers
17:13
stay away from discriminatory and
17:16
exclusive rules and systems
17:20
and keep the functioning of supply
17:21
chains stable
17:24
and smooth
17:27
we need to jointly make the pi of
17:29
convergent interests bigger
17:32
enhance the complementarity and the
17:34
synergy of our national development
17:36
strategies
17:37
and regional and international
17:39
development agendas
17:57
philosophies and models resolve the
18:00
issue of unbalanced and insufficient
18:02
development
18:05
more equal development opportunities
18:08
and make the fruits of development
18:10
shared by all
18:14
need to join hands to promote a green
18:16
transition
18:17
and innovation-driven development
18:21
all countries should uphold the
18:22
principle
18:24
of common but differentiated
18:26
responsibilities
18:28
honestly implement the paris agreement
18:29
on climate change
18:32
and the outcomes of cop 15 of the
18:34
convention on biological diversity
18:40
we need to coordinate efforts in
18:41
economic growth
18:43
people
18:44
it's well-being energy conservation and
18:46
emission reduction
18:48
and pursue a green and low-carbon
18:51
transition of the economy in a holistic
18:54
way
18:57
we need to follow the general direction
18:59
of the ongoing scientific and
19:00
technological revolution and industrial
19:04
information and harness the power of
19:06
scientific and technological innovation
19:08
to drive the transformation and
19:10
upgrading of economic energy industrial
19:13
and consumption structures
19:16
we need to accelerate the conversion of
19:18
scientific and technological outcomes
19:21
into actual productivity
19:36
we need to join hands to improve the
19:38
global governance system
19:42
a fair just an
19:44
incredible global governance system is
19:46
an important safeguard for the steady
19:48
growth of the world economy over the
19:50
long run
19:54
we need to follow the principles of
19:56
extensive consultation join the
19:57
contribution and shared benefits
20:01
to multilateralism
20:11
[Music]
20:17
i support the law for rights and
20:19
interests
20:20
of the developing members of the
20:22
organization
20:25
we need to push forward the imf
20:27
governance reform
20:29
to increase
20:30
the representation and the voice of
20:32
developing countries
20:33
and emerging markets
20:39
we need to jointly discuss and formulate
20:42
global digital governance
20:44
rules why should improve the
20:46
multilateral institutions
20:48
for digital economy governance
20:51
established basic institutions and
20:52
normative standards on the property
20:54
rights transactions
20:56
cross-border transmission
20:58
and the security protection of data
21:00
resources
21:16
distinguished guests
21:18
the china u.s relationship is a matter
21:20
of high interest to many
21:22
yesterday
21:25
president xi jinping and president joe
21:27
biden had a virtual meeting they had an
21:30
extensive and in-depth exchange of views
21:33
on the bilateral relations and other
21:35
issues of mutual interest
21:38
and reached important common
21:39
understandings
21:42
china and the united states
21:44
are respectively the world's biggest
21:46
developing country and the biggest
21:48
developer country
21:50
whether they can handle the relationship
21:51
well
21:52
bears on the future of the
21:57
sides world add all the important common
21:59
understandings reached between the two
22:01
presidents
22:03
keep their focus on cooperation and
22:05
manage and control differences
22:08
so as to bring china u.s relations back
22:10
to the right
22:21
and stability
22:31
[Music]
22:34
please welcome to the stage bloomberg
22:36
television anchor and chief
22:38
international correspondent for
22:39
southeast asia has linda a mean
22:44
[Music]
22:54
morning everybody as you heard i'm
22:55
hustling down and we're going to start
22:57
our program today by taking stock of how
22:59
kevin 19 has appended business
23:02
assumptions
23:03
change
23:04
changed the way we work accelerated the
23:07
march of technology and we were to trade
23:09
now more importantly would like to look
23:11
ahead we're going to look to the future
23:14
out of this catastrophe a new economy is
23:17
being born how can we shape it in ways
23:19
that protect the planet and advance
23:22
prosperity for all
23:25
you know what i think i forgot to remove
23:27
my mask
23:30
have it's farming for months and it's
23:32
been almost two years now
23:35
before we get started
23:36
a few housekeeping notes first please
23:38
share your thoughts during today's
23:40
program on social media using the
23:42
hashtag if you haven't already
23:45
download it that hashtag is new economy
23:47
forum you can get that from the app uh
23:49
the app store
23:51
and um once you're logged in you'll be
23:53
able to participate in our conversations
23:55
on stage through the audience question
23:58
function on the app and the reason we're
24:00
doing this is because of course as you
24:02
saw we're having masks and it's quite
24:05
difficult to to to get you to answer
24:07
questions via a microphone send us your
24:09
questions they'll go to our moderators
24:11
you can put them to individual speakers
24:13
or the panelists now we'll also be doing
24:16
live audience falls in fact let's dive
24:18
straight into that do our first poll of
24:21
the day are you ready
24:26
what will be the pandemic's most
24:27
enduring impact on business would it be
24:30
remote work reduce business travel
24:34
redundant supply chains
24:36
a greener economy
24:39
do summon your questions your answers
24:41
we'll take a look at the results
24:42
slightly later during a
24:45
first panel but before we do that to
24:47
kick it off
24:48
we are some of our nikani farm community
24:50
members who could not be here today in
24:53
person with us to tell us about the one
24:56
thing they think must change coming out
24:59
of the pandemic
25:00
take a listen
25:09
less than two percent
25:11
of the population in low-income
25:12
countries are fully vaccinated at this
25:15
point and that is unacceptable we must
25:18
build our own production capacities
25:22
for vaccines
25:23
and not
25:25
rely on
25:27
those
25:29
facilities that exist in other countries
25:32
they
25:34
attended to their own people first
25:37
so we we were left with nothing next
25:39
time we can't afford to waste valuable
25:41
time creating a new mechanism and
25:43
raising
25:45
to mount a rapid and equitable global
25:47
response change must start here coverage
25:50
shows the paradox of the current global
25:52
order where trade flows supply chains
25:54
bounce back and yet a vital supply
25:57
vaccine
25:58
was instantly politicized and continues
26:01
to be in africa we had such a heavy
26:03
reliance on
26:05
water vaccines nearly 99 percent and we
26:08
need multinational agencies to support
26:10
those regional plans what we do now will
26:12
shape success for all future generations
26:14
we should do one important thing
26:16
rethink how we all approach hiring in
26:19
our companies because note
26:21
this is an unequal recovery i strongly
26:24
do
26:25
that businesses can be a force for drift
26:28
the time to act is now
26:32
[Music]
26:45
[Music]
26:58
[Music]
27:02
please welcome our moderator linda
27:07
ceo of mastercard michael mibach
27:10
founder and chairman of bharti
27:12
enterprises and executive chairman of
27:15
one web sunil abarthi mittal
27:18
and ceo of thetrip.com group jane sun
27:25
[Music]
27:31
now
27:32
the pandemic has had a profound impact
27:34
on the world
27:35
we've seen scientific breakthroughs
27:38
digital innovation that got accelerated
27:40
but we've also seen political failures
27:44
deep
27:45
invites rich versus poor east versus
27:48
west
27:49
vaccine inequity prompting a loss of
27:51
trust and governments as well as
27:53
institutions
27:55
meantime
27:56
businesses made a pivot to survive
27:59
some changes are
28:01
and others
28:02
are here to stay so what have we learned
28:04
from
28:05
this pandemic where do we go from here
28:08
how has covid shaped the world michael
28:13
farah says science saved today
28:16
vaccines
28:18
made the pandemic
28:19
manageable
28:21
in a matter of months
28:23
compared to the early 1900s
28:26
with the flu but yet five million people
28:28
have perished it'll be another six
28:31
months before three quarters of the
28:32
world gets vaccinated with the first jab
28:36
where did we fall short
28:40
i think there's no two ways about it we
28:42
fell short in multiple dimensions
28:46
they just you know shared the tragic
28:48
truth millions of lives were lost when
28:49
it's for sure true
28:51
livelihoods were lost as well so
28:54
you would think that
28:56
when you just consider the impact on
28:57
small business for example clearly the
28:59
hardest hit uh part of economy around
29:01
the world that we would have done a
29:02
better job over the years
29:05
considering that small business is the
29:07
biggest employer to keep them make them
29:08
more resilient and we didn't do that
29:12
the inequalities you talked about
29:14
east-west rich poor the digital has and
29:16
the digital have-nots
29:18
i think we have done a slightly better
29:20
job here because clearly
29:22
as we were all locked up at home the
29:24
world actually did work so
29:26
some homework was done but you can also
29:29
see that the digital divide for those
29:31
that have not been included for whom it
29:33
hasn't worked at all is opening further
29:35
so there's there's lots for us to do
29:37
i think
29:38
private sector plays a role to your
29:40
point about where failures happened i
29:42
think collaboration didn't happen to the
29:45
degree that it could have between
29:47
governments and private sector i see
29:49
much more of that as you think about
29:51
putting technology to good use
29:53
partnerships and good policy
29:55
on standards that ensure that you can
29:57
actually drive technology into
29:59
everybody's hand around the world so it
30:01
can be that force for good
30:03
i'm optimistic that we're going to do
30:04
better
30:05
then we actually took the learnings from
30:07
what happened in the last 18 months and
30:08
so we had all the time in the world to
30:09
prepare for a crisis like the pandemic
30:12
what are some of the key takeaways
30:15
well i have a slightly different take on
30:17
this i mean you can never prepare for
30:19
something like this
30:20
this was uh perhaps in our lifetime once
30:26
that you'll see this
30:27
simultaneous
30:29
almost everywhere in the world they
30:31
started to erupt
30:33
countries which are not very affluent
30:35
emerging india you know south asia
30:38
africa
30:39
generally take a you know
30:41
great deal of effort to deal with their
30:43
normal circumstances
30:46
we don't have the medical care that
30:47
required to deal with our people on in
30:49
normal times
30:50
i mean imagine uh you know catastrophe
30:53
like this a pandemic like this who could
30:55
have prepared themselves
30:57
the western world which is so advanced
30:59
was caught napping
31:01
so there was no question that countries
31:02
like india or bangladesh or africa or
31:06
still would have ever coped with this
31:08
yet let's celebrate the human effort
31:11
the ingenuity of you know mankind how we
31:14
did well
31:15
uh let's start with my own industry
31:17
telecommunications
31:19
people moved from urban centers to
31:21
countryside
31:22
not in tens of thousands
31:26
and millions but hundreds of millions
31:28
people just moved from the urban centers
31:30
people moved overnight from homes to uh
31:32
from offices to homes
31:34
the networks stayed the course
31:37
we shifted traffic overnight
31:39
from urban to rural centres from offices
31:41
to homes
31:42
i personally say this is to be
31:44
celebrated
31:46
because michael likely said work did not
31:48
stop one day we just continued medical
31:51
support emergency support work from home
31:53
regular business supply chains
31:56
everything worked well
31:58
251 million people maybe it's now 255
32:00
million people who have been
32:02
afflicted by this uh you know virus
32:06
five million have unfortunately died as
32:08
two percent as big every life must be
32:10
lost must be
32:12
moaned but the fact is the world has
32:14
come together remarkably against this
32:17
deadly virus so i would really say
32:19
we've done well and you can never ever
32:22
prepare for something like this but we
32:23
could have done better jane
32:26
let's bring you into this conversation i
32:27
mean sitting in china what are the
32:29
changes you're seeing today which you
32:31
didn't think possible 20 months ago
32:35
yes uh the pandemic has presented
32:38
tremendous challenge for the world
32:41
yet we have seen a great collaboration
32:44
in our industry
32:47
uh the technology made it possible for
32:49
us to stay connected with each other and
32:52
more more so
32:54
i see the people care about each other
32:57
no matter there is a border
32:59
among us
33:01
so at the beginning of the pandemic
33:03
china was the first country
33:06
which went into the panamics and we
33:08
received a tremendous support from
33:11
people all around the world from europe
33:13
italy india united states everywhere
33:16
once china was out and the other country
33:20
went into this pandemics and i saw
33:22
tremendous love and care from
33:26
china to the rest of the world and even
33:28
children in the city of shanghai raised
33:31
funds for the refugee kids in the middle
33:33
east to support them so i
33:36
saw a lot of challenges in the past two
33:38
years but it gives me a lot of hope that
33:42
through the collaboration through
33:44
technology
33:46
and through our human kindness we'll be
33:48
able to overcome a lot of challenges
33:51
michael cino talked earlier about how
33:53
basically we did not miss a beat life
33:55
went on work went on but there have been
33:57
changes
33:59
expectations of workers have changed
34:01
uh the great resignation is a thing not
34:04
just in the us which
34:06
for a recognition of about more than
34:08
four million people at their work the uk
34:10
is doing the same thing those in canada
34:12
are doing the same thing and the recent
34:14
survey here in singapore suggested that
34:16
of the people of all the people that
34:18
were surveyed 50
34:20
were re-looking at whether they wanted
34:22
to stay in their jobs or not so
34:24
expectations of workers
34:26
have changed sitting here as a ceo of a
34:28
company a huge company how do you see
34:30
the issue yes so the the great
34:31
resignation the great assessment or the
34:34
great reset i mean it's all a reality
34:36
but if you unpacked it
34:37
a bit i see it particularly pronounced
34:41
not so much in questions as in i need a
34:44
new source of energy
34:46
in my life and i'm rethinking it is
34:48
simply um
34:50
in industries that are in great demand
34:52
hospitality healthcare great stress
34:54
a lot of competition for best people in
34:56
our industry anybody who knows anything
34:58
in ai digital digital identity cyber
35:02
hot skills those are the people that are
35:04
in demand
35:06
and those are the people they're saying
35:08
i am feeling huge pressure every day in
35:10
what i do can i do better let me look
35:13
elsewhere even if i cannot do better
35:15
maybe i can be paid better so there's a
35:17
lot of competition going on and that's
35:19
been always the case in these industries
35:21
now pronounced because the pandemic put
35:23
a lot of pressure on the system
35:26
i think that's the fundamental trend um
35:29
when you peel the onion a bit more
35:31
there's an aspect about people are
35:34
looking for some source of additional
35:36
fulfillment
35:37
um they won't be connected to their
35:39
passions make a difference i'll give you
35:40
an example we last year we said you're
35:42
all very busy the zoom days are
35:46
blur
35:47
would you like to do something else
35:48
beyond and hands went up across the
35:50
company is i want to help on financial
35:52
inclusion i want to help on you know
35:54
helping small business etc so that does
35:57
play a role but it's fundamentally
35:59
competition for for hot skills that are
36:01
under great demand
36:02
what do you have to do as an employer
36:05
recognize
36:06
that it's a reality and say i have
36:09
targeted compensation plans i ensure
36:11
well-being is a thing now because we are
36:13
seeing a lot of people getting close to
36:14
burnout because of all of that demand um
36:17
so it is happening
36:19
um
36:20
i i think it's going to be something
36:22
that we will see for a period of time as
36:25
the
36:26
the recovery from covet is not going to
36:28
be near term so it's going to be with us
36:30
for a while and as the private sector we
36:32
have to manage through that carefully
36:33
but i think there's been good learnings
36:35
in the last 18 months what are you
36:37
seeing in india a billion people
36:38
millions joining the workforce every
36:40
single year
36:42
a great reassessment
36:44
yeah you know for india livelihoods
36:46
always were
36:47
perhaps a little more important
36:50
people need work people have to work we
36:54
still have to get wealthy as a nation
36:57
but there has been a fundamental shift
36:59
and you see it from very close quarters
37:01
people
37:02
you know are reassessing their options
37:07
uh my own viewers if you press everybody
37:08
to come back to the office and by the
37:09
way i'm in
37:11
michael bloomberg's camp which says we
37:12
must work as groups we must work as
37:15
teams we need to get back to the office
37:17
but by you to press everybody to come to
37:19
office
37:20
perhaps a very large section of them may
37:21
not want to come back
37:23
now is is this permanent
37:26
can they afford to stay away from our
37:28
work stream or just do jobs which can
37:30
allow them the flexibility it's hard to
37:32
predict
37:41
the problem is
37:43
you allow
37:52
bus or a car to do the one hour drive
37:54
back and forth
37:56
it just becomes an unfair situation do
37:58
you create a separate cardo for work
38:00
from home who have lower increments who
38:02
have slower career options
38:04
uh compared to
38:06
those people who make the sacrifice to
38:08
come to office this is the conundrum
38:09
each one of us as chief executives are
38:11
going to face
38:12
and large part i would say is also now
38:15
people are not used to getting dressed
38:16
up in the morning and get getting ready
38:18
to work
38:18
[Laughter]
38:19
you have to special occasion today yeah
38:22
you have to shake up the lethargy you
38:24
got to get them back and i can tell you
38:27
once you're back in the routine and i'm
38:29
checking with people almost daily in my
38:30
office 95 people are back my operating
38:34
units are still 50
38:36
but once people decide to come back they
38:38
enjoy it they like it so my view is
38:41
everything is assessed at a particular
38:43
point in time
38:44
eventually when the world comes
38:47
back to near normal you'll never be
38:48
normal i think you'll start to see
38:50
people coming back to work a lot more
38:52
michael i'll get back to you i know you
38:53
want to just make a comment on his
38:55
return to uh office work uh question the
38:58
um
39:00
the concentration is really in
39:02
white-collar workers who have the choice
39:04
the vast majority of people actually
39:05
don't even have a
39:07
choice so that's a it's a question
39:09
that's discussed with a minority
39:11
essentially
39:12
and here i think there's a risk of
39:14
unintended side consequences everything
39:16
you said people that can't make the
39:17
sacrifice or not but just think about
39:19
the following what happens once the mute
39:21
button is pressed what happens after the
39:23
meeting this is when there's impact of
39:25
careers that
39:27
are being shaped and imagine a world
39:28
that is let's say a lot of women making
39:30
the decision to work from home so they
39:32
can support their families better and
39:34
men do the other side you have a
39:36
perpetuation of
39:38
lack of gender diversity that those are
39:40
some of the intended side consequences
39:42
we really have to think through so i'm
39:43
with you
39:45
back together is better
39:47
i got it the right way and jane when you
39:49
take a look at china the young people
39:50
are pretty disillusioned uh they're
39:52
finding it difficult to find jobs
39:54
they're not getting married fertility
39:56
rate at 1.3
39:58
what's the sense you're getting there
40:00
yes china
40:03
control the virus very well so last year
40:07
in february we already went back to work
40:10
uh full force now we are taking the
40:13
opportunity to evaluate the new hybrid
40:16
model uh so we run a b testing and pilot
40:19
program which enable our
40:22
employees to have a choice whether work
40:25
in the office or
40:27
at home so far our testing have shown
40:30
that the job satisfaction has increased
40:33
significantly um and productivity is
40:36
adhered to
40:37
so we're very pleased with the result a
40:40
different group in different regions has
40:42
shown different favors in terms of where
40:45
one they want to work
40:47
generation z and millennials prefer to
40:50
work in office because they should they
40:53
have seen enjoy the social environment
40:55
in office
40:57
working mothers really enjoy have the
40:59
flexibility to have a hybrid model so we
41:03
are still keeping monitoring the process
41:05
to make sure
41:07
that our productivity and job
41:10
satisfaction are enhanced by offering
41:12
the alternatives to our employees before
41:15
we touch on technology i want to just
41:17
quickly touch on travel has it changed
41:20
you know because we had i think tata's
41:22
china sacrament saying that you know
41:24
he's not going to make that
41:26
[Music]
41:27
halfway around the world to do a 30
41:30
minute speech unless of course it is for
41:32
the new economy forum so now what's your
41:34
take on that
41:35
i think that perhaps has fundamentally
41:37
changed if i if i look at look back at
41:40
my long years in bingham business
41:43
i'm amazed how i was packing and
41:45
unpacking all the time
41:48
before you unpack the other stress to
41:49
pack again because you need to move the
41:51
second or third day to another country
41:52
another place
41:54
i can't imagine doing that ever again so
41:56
when i've been traveling of course
41:58
travel has been relatively less i go and
42:00
anchor myself if i'm going from delhi to
42:02
london i'm there for a long period of
42:03
time rather than two days which i used
42:06
to do
42:07
early on the rush back or go to africa
42:09
or go to the us that has changed so i
42:10
would say i would roll in more meetings
42:12
around that place
42:13
do partial virtual and partial physical
42:16
and then get back but who knows i mean
42:18
i'm talking about right now
42:20
you you know we may just be back to the
42:22
old usual self but i think business
42:25
travel will suffer
42:27
from the levels it was before pandemic
42:30
so we have the finger on the pulse it's
42:32
just what we do for a living at
42:33
mastercard so we know what people do do
42:35
they do what sunil does or do they do
42:37
something different and what is what is
42:39
shown as and when travel corridors
42:41
opened
42:42
people did travel it all started with
42:45
leisure travel everybody
42:47
but is that just pent up demand yeah it
42:49
is you know seeing a family friends
42:51
again that is pent up demand but
42:53
the first the first corridors opened
42:56
you're starting to see now at a point is
42:58
you would have seen everybody and people
43:00
still travel so leisure travel kicks in
43:02
as in you're not going home you're going
43:04
to the caribbean uh so we
43:07
can actually over the summer now
43:08
business travel you're starting to see
43:10
about a six month delay on business
43:12
travel coming back
43:14
you know in conversations that i have
43:16
with airlines and people who are
43:17
customers and partners is is all about
43:20
leisure travel but as business travel
43:22
comes back you start to see customer
43:24
facing travel as a reality in
43:27
internal travel not so much you wouldn't
43:29
do
43:30
get 300 people in a room somewhere just
43:32
to talk about your own company so i
43:34
think there's moderation in the end
43:36
we'll see business level not coming back
43:38
to the same level that it was
43:40
jane definitely has the pulse on the
43:42
travel industry jane what's your take i
43:44
mean the sense out there at least
43:47
according to surveys is that 50 of
43:49
business travel will suffer
43:55
sorry the translation somehow connects
43:57
to my line so um yeah what we have seen
44:01
is uh two trends uh the first of all uh
44:04
the trends can you hear me okay because
44:06
the translation line is
44:08
we can jane go ahead
44:11
okay great so if it is one-on-one kind
44:14
of conversation it's very easy to be
44:17
replaced by a zoom call so it becomes
44:20
more efficient without travel however to
44:23
attend a conference like this i think
44:25
you will be able to meet a lot of global
44:28
leaders the value is still there so in
44:30
china where the business travel
44:32
is a robot we have seen more than 30
44:36
percent year-over-year growth for our
44:38
business travelers so uh my feeling is
44:42
uh when the uh
44:44
pandemics is over uh there will
44:47
be a pent-up demand still addressing the
44:51
business travel secondly with the work
44:54
uh at home program a lot of people will
44:57
be able to stay on the beach to have a
44:59
business call so right now in china a
45:02
very popular new world is workation
45:08
work and vacation integrated so coming
45:11
up with new products to address this
45:14
kind of demand
45:15
we learn what's every day so this is
45:18
right up your alley let's talk
45:19
technology everything online it was
45:21
amazing that the internet didn't crash
45:24
right the thing is how do you build that
45:26
technology to ensure that when the next
45:28
pandemic happens when there is
45:31
a crisis we're able to overcome even
45:33
better what needs
45:35
to be looked into what needs to be
45:37
invested into
45:39
basically i would say hard
45:41
infrastructure you need to ensure that
45:42
the underlying connectivity network
45:45
is powerful
45:48
has enough capacity and a great speed
45:50
and latency to ensure that the traffic
45:52
that is surging across the globe is well
45:54
handled secondly we must remember
45:56
there's a large part of the globe which
45:58
is still not on internet
46:01
and our last calculation suggests we
46:02
need about half a trillion dollars
46:04
to cover the rest of the world who are
46:06
not connected
46:07
today largely in the under developed
46:09
countries but even places like the us
46:11
where fcc has just done an art off rural
46:13
development opportunity fund there are
46:16
parts of u.s which don't have internet
46:18
they're parts of canada which don't have
46:19
internet so i think that is a
46:22
simultaneous equation develop and create
46:24
more robust connectivity in areas we
46:26
already are
46:28
enhance your network capacities and
46:30
quality and go to the areas which are
46:32
dark
46:32
africa very large portions of you know
46:35
people are still not on internet so all
46:37
that requires a lot of work and that
46:39
needs five seven years we need to start
46:41
to work on it now
46:43
and the pandemic has pushed
46:46
i guess the
46:48
technology to a tipping point that has
46:50
transformed business forever it has it
46:53
has now it's starting with broadband
46:54
access 3.7 billion people don't have
46:57
access at all but if you didn't say if
46:59
you assume for a moment there is a
47:01
there is access
47:02
still we've seen a lot of progress and a
47:04
lot of push throughout the last 18
47:06
months of what
47:08
needs to happen imagine a brave new
47:10
digital world and there's all these new
47:11
people that are starting to use digital
47:13
solutions that haven't before because
47:14
they didn't have a choice they had to
47:16
like ordering groceries online they
47:18
start to do that
47:19
their question of digital trust is
47:21
essential because they're not familiar
47:23
and they don't know how to stay safe
47:24
same for a small business they might
47:26
have been brick and mortar and just
47:29
change their approach to have some
47:30
online delivery proposition and they get
47:32
hacked so question of digital trust
47:34
investment in cyber security cyber
47:36
resilience and cyber
47:38
oriented policies
47:40
um is absolutely critical and i think
47:42
the real game changer when it comes to
47:44
where else should be a priority an
47:46
investment for uh
47:48
to put technology to good use to give us
47:49
that productivity boost that we all want
47:51
is digital identity in a world of
47:54
you know in a world that is all digital
47:56
if you do not have a digital identity
47:57
you are a digital have not and that is a
47:59
fundamental problem that has not been
48:01
solved it's not been solved consistently
48:03
some countries made real progress
48:05
there's a lot of infrastructure
48:08
india technology stack some countries in
48:10
the nordics that progress that but it is
48:12
a gaping hole in this world and i think
48:14
there's uh that's what we should draw
48:16
our attention to
48:17
jane how are you looking at technology
48:20
absolutely it's enabler during this very
48:23
challenging time
56:50
[Music]
56:57
please welcome to the stage global
57:00
managing partner of mckenzie and company
57:02
bob
57:04
[Music]
57:10
stenfels hi everybody thank you it's um
57:14
it's my honor to uh to be a fire starter
57:17
for the next um uh breakout group new
57:20
paradigm for global businesses
57:22
and um as the last discussion session
57:25
highlighted
57:26
the importance of tech for our future um
57:29
is is absolutely central and i i fully
57:32
agree with that
57:33
um i would offer though that to meet the
57:36
collective challenges we're going to
57:37
need more than technology breakthroughs
57:40
we're going to need bold and urgent
57:41
leadership
57:42
so for this fire starter let me tee up
57:45
three messages three messages
57:48
the first message is the stakes are
57:50
incredibly high stakes are incredibly
57:52
high and as we look forward over the
57:55
course of this decade
57:56
we're at a crossroads and i could paint
57:59
two very different scenarios
58:01
for how this decade could play out
58:04
the first
58:05
a new age of prosperity
58:08
could grow 30 to 50 percent over this
58:11
decade with a better quality of life for
58:13
most people
58:14
a more sustainable future for our planet
58:17
true sustainable inclusive growth one
58:20
path
58:21
second path doesn't look so good it has
58:24
tepid economic recovery only 10 to 20
58:28
percent increase in gdp growth less
58:30
equitable distribution less sustainable
58:33
with worse outcomes for global health in
58:35
the environment
58:36
two radically different paths
58:39
and the stakes couldn't be higher let me
58:40
let me give a few specifics to this if
58:43
you consider climate
58:45
if we don't improve the net zero
58:48
commitments that we've all made
58:49
substantially improve we'll have one
58:52
billion people
58:53
living in lethal heat by twenty fifty
58:56
one billion people
58:58
if we think about inequality
59:00
seven of ten people today live in
59:03
societies with growing inequality
59:06
and we've seen the massive stress
59:08
that places on both public and private
59:11
institutions
59:13
and in terms of economic growth the
59:14
bookend scenarios have never been wider
59:16
than they are today as we forecast what
59:19
could be
59:20
so the stakes are high
59:22
now the second message however is we can
59:25
do this we can live into the first
59:26
scenario
59:29
at mckinsey we've done some modeling and
59:31
believe that we could have three to four
59:32
percent per annum uh gdp growth over
59:35
this decade from existing technologies
59:37
from existing technologies
59:40
similarly those same technologies if we
59:43
look at europe in particular could abate
59:46
85 percent
59:48
of the carbon today 85 percent in europe
59:51
from his existing technologies
59:53
and if you look at job creation
59:55
there is a scenario with substantial net
59:58
job growth over this decade
60:00
it requires investment in sectors from
60:02
infrastructure health care to energy
60:04
but done right job growth
60:07
can outstrip jobs dislocated through
60:09
technology two to one
60:11
two to one but it requires the right
60:13
focus on upskilling
60:16
and the goals of sustainability
60:18
inclusion and growth can also reinforce
60:20
each other and create a virtuous circle
60:23
let me let me give some specifics
60:26
more inclusive healthcare
60:28
could add half a point to global gdp
60:30
growth by 2040.
60:32
advancing women's economic potential in
60:34
the workforce could add 13 trillion to
60:36
global gdp growth
60:39
and growth rates for sustainable
60:40
products and markets outstrip
60:42
conventional ones 10 to 20 percent in
60:45
all categories
60:48
now i'm not naive driving all three
60:51
sustainability inclusion and growth
60:52
won't be easy and there's some real
60:54
tensions that need to be addressed
60:56
as technology is implemented at an ever
60:58
faster rate a hundred million people
61:00
will be need to reskilled this decade
61:03
100 million people
61:05
and energy transitions if we don't
61:07
focus will be regressive
61:10
they will be regressive if i take the us
61:12
alone
61:13
60 of low-income households face severe
61:16
energy burdens meaning they spend over
61:18
10 percent of total household income on
61:20
energy
61:21
just transitions have to be a crucial
61:23
component as we think about climate
61:25
transition
61:26
and i think we all know as
61:28
business leaders it's not easy
61:30
forty percent of our workforce right now
61:32
wants to change jobs in the next six
61:33
months the regulatory environment is
61:36
increasingly uncertain and we have
61:38
multiple stakeholder management to lean
61:40
forward if we want to be bolder all
61:42
these things come together
61:44
but i'd argue it is a time for us as
61:46
leaders to embrace long-term
61:49
capital and to be courageous which
61:50
brings me to my last my last message
61:53
we need to work together and we need to
61:55
move quickly
61:56
in reaching for sustainable inclusive
61:58
growth we have to work across the public
62:01
private divide as mike said in his
62:03
opening
62:04
it's the only way we'll find solutions
62:06
to things like standards for clients
62:10
for a mechanism that creates real
62:12
incentive to invest in human capital
62:14
and for a framework that allows us r d
62:16
investments to accelerate over this
62:18
decade to solve some of these toughest
62:20
problems
62:22
we also have to move quickly
62:24
what one thing that covet has shown is
62:26
that enterprise can move faster than
62:28
any of us expected which is good news
62:31
because these problems aren't going to
62:33
be the problems of the next generation
62:35
they're going to be the problems of our
62:36
leadership generation
62:38
so the question i have is can we lock in
62:40
this coveted speed to solve these
62:42
particular issues
62:44
so the choice is ours
62:46
we have a moment right
62:49
now to drive sustainable inclusive
62:51
growth
62:52
that won't be easy
62:54
but i'd argue we should accept nothing
62:56
less and as we go to this next panel the
62:58
question i'd ask each of you
63:00
is are we being bold enough as leaders
63:02
as we plot our course
63:04
thank you
63:05
[Applause]
63:10
ifp test test test ift test test test
63:16
[Music]
63:51
[Music]
64:06
[Music]
64:30
[Music]
64:36
[Music]
64:53
and his panelists president of the new
64:55
york stock exchange group stacey
64:57
cunningham ceo of dps group piers gupta
65:00
managing director and vice chairman of
65:02
pimco john stevzinski and chairman of
65:05
ubs group axel a
65:07
[Music]
65:15
well good morning everybody
65:17
i'm absolutely delighted to be here with
65:19
my lively and highly engaged panel and
65:22
to see you here this morning
65:24
uh before we begin i do want to remind
65:26
you
65:27
that you have the app
65:29
you've been using them already to answer
65:31
the panels
65:32
excuse me answer the polls but you can
65:34
also use them to send questions for the
65:37
panel and i'll be looking for your
65:38
questions as they come in and i'll try
65:40
to weave them into our conversation so
65:42
please
65:43
engage with me engage with the panel and
65:46
we'll make it collaborative
65:49
we have a great question to answer today
65:51
it is a question that every ceo every
65:54
cio and every boardroom around the world
65:57
should be asking itself
65:59
is there a new paradigm for global
66:02
business
66:04
we have a pretty good idea of what the
66:05
old paradigm was
66:07
we could call it globalization and that
66:09
paradigm had some highly identifiable
66:12
characteristics
66:14
free movement of capital for example
66:16
trade liberalization supply chain
66:18
expansion
66:19
cross-border interdependence and
66:21
multilateralism
66:23
also resource exploitation weight
66:26
stagnation to a degree
66:28
institutional authority
66:30
it sure feels to me and i think to
66:32
others here that that paradigm has
66:34
changed awfully fast i would point
66:38
to among other things
66:40
inflation
66:41
esg and crypto as evidence
66:44
that something is happening so i'd like
66:47
to begin
66:50
by asking
66:51
our panel
66:52
do you believe that there is
66:54
a new paradigm for global business if so
66:57
what are its dominant characteristics
67:00
are they different from the old ones and
67:02
if so how
67:03
and if there isn't
67:05
a new paradigm for global business
67:08
why not
67:09
stacy i'd like you to start the
67:10
conversation well there's definitely a
67:13
new paradigm for global business and i'm
67:14
not sure that any one of us up here can
67:16
tell you exactly what that's going to
67:17
look like just yet because there are so
67:19
many unknowns and there are so many
67:21
things happening at the same time and
67:23
their interaction is really what is
67:25
going to decide and determine what the
67:29
future of business looks like and so
67:31
many of the topics that eric mentioned
67:32
are related to that and and moving into
67:34
that but it's other things as well and
67:36
some of them are driven by
67:38
the consumer the consumer wanting a more
67:40
direct impact on their choices employees
67:43
wanting a more direct impact on how they
67:45
decide and what they want to do what
67:47
flexibility they want
67:50
the wages where they're working what
67:52
industries they're in i mean there's so
67:53
many things happening at the same time
67:55
with also looking at the globalization
67:58
of so many industries so it's definitely
67:59
going to change but i'm not smart enough
68:01
to tell you what it's going to look like
68:03
who is
68:04
well eric i i think we've also now
68:07
first of all i think we've seen the dog
68:10
but we haven't it's going to take us
68:12
quite a few years to be able to connect
68:13
the dots to see what the new paradigm
68:15
looks like
68:16
i do think though
68:18
following on tracy's comment about the
68:19
individual
68:21
i think one of the things this whole
68:22
debate about climate reaction
68:25
covet is really the first major
68:26
sustainability crisis
68:29
and it's game changing but i think that
68:31
also reintroduces this whole discussion
68:33
of the common good
68:35
and i think the expression of the common
68:37
good is something we're very conscious
68:39
of but it varies culturally and it's
68:42
something that
68:43
the americans talk about and it's
68:45
obviously something now the chinese very
68:46
much talked about in the context of
68:48
common
68:49
prosperity and the recent plenum so
68:52
i think we need to add to stacy's point
68:56
the individual and the sort of me
68:58
orientation particularly in very much in
69:00
the american
69:01
economy
69:02
to the notion of the common good and how
69:05
the new business model is going to
69:06
address the common good
69:10
if i can
69:11
come in so first of all i'm not in the
69:13
camp of the world is de-globalizing and
69:14
maybe we'll talk about that separately
69:17
but i have two messages first is i don't
69:19
think there's just a new paradigm for
69:21
global business i think there's a new
69:23
paradigm for how we run the world
69:25
and that's a lot more consequential than
69:27
how you run business
69:30
i think there are two big drivers which
69:32
we need to be really cognizant of one is
69:34
we're trying to wean away from a fossil
69:36
fuel carbon-led economy something we've
69:38
created over the last 150 years and very
69:41
rapidly swing to a completely new
69:43
economic construct there's trillions and
69:45
trillions of dollars of extant
69:47
infrastructure investment which needs to
69:49
be transitioned that's no small feat
69:52
the second is people haven't talked
69:54
about it so much wang jishan mentioned
69:56
it
69:56
i think the impact of technology in the
69:58
next decade is going to be completely
70:01
game changing
70:02
uh that includes a web 3 with
70:04
self-sovereign individuals and
70:06
self-sovereign identities it includes ai
70:10
with artificial general intelligence
70:11
increasingly allowing us to outsource
70:12
our brains and it includes a 5g world
70:15
where holographic and 3d etc make
70:17
virtual reality possible i think when
70:19
you couple this uh these two pedals i
70:22
think the green pedal and the technology
70:24
pedal one consequence of this is going
70:26
to be massive social
70:28
redistribution
70:30
so the poor people the poor countries
70:32
the lesser developed countries will face
70:35
the brunt of this transition more than
70:36
better people and that is going to
70:38
create a lot of social unrest so in that
70:40
context i think that's my second message
70:42
we have to rethink how we run the world
70:45
and that has two three big dimensions
70:46
one is role of governments
70:48
i think
70:50
you will increasingly get the world but
70:51
you have to have a lot more activist
70:52
role of the public sector that doesn't
70:54
necessarily mean big government but it
70:56
does mean more activist government
70:57
because some of the questions we're
70:59
going to deal with are questions of what
71:01
makes us human what makes us
71:02
philosophically uh the question of
71:04
philosophy i need people to help
71:06
shepherd a common state for society and
71:08
direction that's
71:10
activist government i think you need
71:11
government to catalyze investments you
71:13
need governmental de-risk investments
71:15
that's an activist government by the way
71:16
this is not the first time it's happened
71:18
you know it's happened in the 18th
71:19
century
71:20
in the fiscal sense it happened with
71:22
japan post-world war it happened with
71:24
darpa and nasa driving silicon valley in
71:27
the u.s and frankly i've seen it in
71:28
singapore since
71:30
was the best case point activist
71:31
government but i think you'll also need
71:33
a private sector which is a little bit
71:35
more attuned to what's popularly now
71:37
called stakeholder capitalism i.e a
71:39
common good agenda not just a
71:41
shareholder good agenda so i think you
71:42
need that to come together and i think
71:44
the ppp will be public private and
71:47
people because the capacity of the
71:49
individual to have a voice with social
71:52
media in the new world means the people
71:53
sector is going to be a relevant sector
71:55
one thing i think we need to take away
71:57
from this when i say manage the world
71:58
our current global multilateral
72:00
institutions are failing us we will have
72:02
to come together as one people and
72:04
therefore i can see again wang shishan a
72:06
completely new infrastructure and
72:08
architecture for
72:10
managing the digital world in the
72:11
digital economy at a global level the
72:12
united nations for digital but also i
72:15
see maybe dialing up within the current
72:17
infrastructure a new impetus for the
72:19
green economy and the green worlds i
72:20
think there's a lot of shits we need to
72:22
see in the coming decade
72:24
well if i just uh i think every time we
72:27
are in a crisis people say
72:30
this time it's different and every time
72:31
we come out of a crisis uh one of the
72:33
strongest features we find in mankind is
72:34
habit persistence we go back to our old
72:37
way so i'm much more on the page that
72:40
yes we are in a crisis crisis usually
72:42
are best managed by governments because
72:44
they have unlimited resources and can
72:46
act fast and they can actually enforce
72:48
things
72:50
so that's why we created states that's
72:52
why we created governments and
72:53
governments do their job in a crisis i
72:55
mean
72:56
say hank in the room governments did
72:58
their job in the financial crisis
73:00
governments will do their job in the
73:01
pandemic crisis we had repeated crisis
73:03
in finance that's why we created a
73:05
financial crisis infrastructure at the
73:07
global level with the imf the world bank
73:10
we didn't have that in the pandemic
73:12
world we're now moving from pandemic to
73:14
endemic we have to start living with
73:16
viruses uh globally and we need to
73:19
create a kind of infrastructure there
73:20
the wto existed but it wasn't a global
73:23
coordinator and the responses were
73:25
fragmented national even regional and we
73:28
locked down systems we locked downtowns
73:30
that's not a good response and i think
73:32
we need to move to a better place in
73:34
response but i think the way we will do
73:36
business will be influenced by other
73:38
things than the pandemic the pandemic
73:40
has sort of shown us that we're
73:42
vulnerable on globalization because now
73:45
every crisis we had is global by
73:47
definition and there are
73:50
other global crisis one of the crisis
73:52
that is in the back is the sort of
73:53
environmental crisis
73:55
but i'm a stern believer that through
73:57
research development but also to
73:59
determined efforts we got on top of
74:01
these so the mega trends that we're
74:03
seeing that pious mentioned
74:04
digitalization uh the whole
74:06
sustainability discussion those will be
74:09
parts of doing business they're not
74:11
external events that influence business
74:13
they are part of how we do business and
74:15
it has to be put in our business models
74:17
and i think that's how we will change
74:19
but that's adaption to the circumstance
74:21
and i think that's what mankind is
74:23
really done all the time i don't think
74:26
we're in a new normal we're just coming
74:27
out of a really bad situation
74:31
and we'll learn our lessons from that
74:32
and be better in the future
74:33
actually i completely agree with you
74:34
that that the government played such a
74:36
critical role in crisis and and is so
74:38
necessary and we saw swift action back
74:40
in in spring of 2020 but the private
74:43
sector did too and we wouldn't be
74:45
sitting here together if we weren't all
74:47
vaccinated and businesses didn't rise to
74:49
the challenge of heroics to develop
74:52
vaccines we saw so many businesses over
74:54
the past 18 months looking for ways to
74:57
solve problems whether they be about
74:58
sustainability and esg or you know and
75:01
from my seat at the new york stock
75:02
exchange we're seeing companies coming
75:03
public all the time many of them
75:05
providing technologies to address issues
75:07
that they recognize whether
75:10
whether it be supporting small and
75:11
mid-sized businesses or you know i see
75:13
sarah fire out there next door
75:15
developing communities because community
75:16
is such such a uh an important part of
75:19
our recovery and so all of those things
75:22
that the private sector is doing are so
75:24
critical yet there's such an adversarial
75:26
relationship between the public sector
75:28
and the private sector
75:31
it's no contradiction because what you
75:32
see is in a situation where you are in
75:34
the crisis the government can play a
75:35
role by coordinating and by intervening
75:38
it's as important when you come out of
75:40
the crisis that the government retreats
75:42
that the government lets markets and
75:44
corporates take over again we've seen
75:46
that in the financial crisis there was a
75:48
re-regulation but now the
75:50
financial industry is actually much
75:52
stronger than we were before the crisis
75:54
so it's it's a give and take the
75:56
government plays a role in a crisis but
75:57
if they stay in crisis mode all the time
75:59
we're really moving down the wrong track
76:01
i agree with you i think one thing i
76:03
wanted to to bridge this conversation i
76:06
i think actually
76:07
it really depends what country and
76:09
culture you're in if
76:11
if you go to europe the governments have
76:12
a much more engaged role in
76:16
running the society
76:17
if you go to america for example where
76:20
it's become a very
76:22
the new political agenda is so
76:24
short-termist in america that the people
76:26
who are assuming a much bigger role in
76:28
the society are the very big
76:30
corporations and one of the things
76:32
that's interesting stacey is
76:34
who are the people that are having the
76:35
biggest impact on climate and during the
76:38
vaccine movement it's actually the
76:40
employees of the big companies
76:42
and the pension fund holders of the big
76:45
companies because every day the ceo now
76:47
in the last two or three years has
76:50
has to deal with activist groups
76:52
internally so these groups are having
76:55
big influence on issues of climate
76:58
brown to green big influence on vaccines
77:01
big influence on how the pandemic is
77:03
managed and big influence on lifestyle
77:06
so i think it varies and then you go to
77:08
asia
77:09
where you have a
77:10
very different dynamic between the
77:12
governments and the corporations so i i
77:14
think you can't really generalize the
77:16
thing we can't forget though and i want
77:18
to keep this
77:19
reintroducing the individual here we
77:22
have the government's
77:23
this whole climate debate
77:25
eric you have we have the governments
77:27
we have corporations you don't hear
77:28
enough about what the
77:30
average person who doesn't want to get
77:32
left behind where's that person going to
77:34
be in terms of getting retrained with
77:36
digital to all the things that that
77:38
you've been raised we have a question
77:40
here that pertains to what we've already
77:43
discussed
77:44
and i'm going to pose it to the panel
77:46
can we rely on companies to protect the
77:49
car
77:51
and good
77:52
through esg involuntary compliance or
77:54
do we need to ask government to use the
77:56
mandatory levers of taxes and regulation
78:00
to accomplish that psu we're about to
78:02
say something so i'm going to throw this
78:03
to you well i think the answer is yes
78:05
and yes
78:05
[Laughter]
78:07
i think without a doubt the
78:11
business agenda and company agenda is
78:13
morphing if if it wasn't already there
78:15
so the roundtable the business com this
78:18
round leaders roundtable in the u.s is
78:19
the case in point
78:21
but increasingly the understanding of
78:24
having to respond to multiple
78:25
stakeholders
78:26
is their own company the pension funds
78:28
are investors the ngos
78:31
marketplace or consumers are employees
78:33
they're expecting it to us you don't
78:34
have a choice um but by the way i also
78:36
come to this thing that if you think
78:38
long term then there's really not that
78:40
much conflict between your shareholder
78:42
commitments and other stakeholder
78:43
commitments i mean if you want to give a
78:45
decent return to your shareholder over
78:46
30 years you'd better be around for 30
78:49
years and the only way
78:51
you're around for 30 years is you need a
78:52
license from civil society so you've got
78:54
to earn that license but at the same
78:56
time
78:56
there are other things where it's quite
78:57
clear to me the public sector is the
78:59
only way you get to play a role you want
79:01
to go a global attacks on carbon i can
79:04
tell you no private sector company can
79:05
create a tax on carbon into the
79:06
government to do that you need
79:08
rules around measurements you
79:11
need rules around transition pathways if
79:13
you don't have an activist public sector
79:14
role this will never happen so as with
79:16
everything else we saw that in the
79:17
financial sector the gfc you can leave
79:19
the market forces completely to
79:21
themselves and then turns out that's
79:23
inadequate you need to have stronger you
79:24
know regulations supervision frameworks
79:27
so i think that balance is what you need
79:29
and that's why um
79:31
yes and yes i want to quickly go back to
79:33
this earlier point i think john
79:35
was saying this is right i think some of
79:36
the responses of do you need active
79:39
government only in a crisis or do you
79:41
need active government all the time is a
79:43
social political uh issue issue i'm
79:46
going to come back
79:47
the way we are it has been an activist
79:49
government and maybe
79:51
india talk about it in singapore the
79:52
small country 5 million people but the
79:54
fantastic example for what an activist
79:55
government can do through cycle not just
79:57
in crisis i do actually want to come
79:59
back to that point but
80:01
because we're eager to engage the
80:03
audience
80:04
i want to talk about this i referred to
80:07
the old paradigm i gave it a name
80:08
globalization before but
80:11
it had a supportive environment right of
80:13
subdued market volatility when we didn't
80:14
have a financial crisis on our hands
80:17
political stability and of course low
80:19
inflation
80:21
we have a poll and i'll bring it up so
80:23
that you can see it folks
80:25
this is the question are central banks
80:27
underestimating inflation answer a
80:31
there's too much government stimulus
80:33
spending excuse me monetary stimulus b
80:35
absolutely it's structural and we're
80:37
heading for stagflation c
80:40
no inflation is a temporary phenomenon
80:43
linked to supply shocks and worker
80:45
shortages so let's give the audience a
80:47
chance to answer that question
80:50
and as they do
80:52
panel
80:53
how would you have answered the question
80:54
stacy
80:56
i would go with c but temporary is a
80:59
subjective term would you prefer
81:00
transitory
81:01
well it's too hard to it's hard to say
81:03
exactly how long that'll last
81:06
i don't agree so
81:08
i think inflation is
81:11
getting to be a lot more a structure for
81:14
two or three um
81:15
i mean the two three anecdotal
81:17
observations one is a lot of inflation
81:19
is now wage inflation i'm seeing wages
81:21
go up everywhere um not just in the u.s
81:24
but in our part of the world i was
81:25
mentioning before i announced uh in
81:28
december that there'd be no wage
81:29
increases in my company this year that
81:32
uh pronouncement lasted 100 days i
81:34
started losing people we had to
81:36
most of my clients are doing that so
81:38
wage inflation is sticky it doesn't go
81:40
away
81:40
second the energy uh issues as we're
81:43
trying to
81:44
d or disinvest in the fossil fuel
81:46
economy and shifting i think the
81:49
structural shift is going to drive
81:51
energy price inflation and on the supply
81:53
chain all our clients i talked to at the
81:55
ports and the ships and so on i don't
81:57
think the supply chain is a one two
81:58
three four month issue it could be two
82:00
three four quarters and what happens is
82:02
when you start seeing sticker prices of
82:03
six and seven percent that starts
82:05
building inflation expectations and once
82:08
in inflation expectations get anchored
82:12
then you get into the spirals so i don't
82:13
think it's such a temporary phenomena
82:15
john how would you answer let's remember
82:17
inflation's at a 31 year high at least
82:19
the data that came out of the united
82:21
states it's clearly going to remain high
82:23
for the foreseeable future so there's
82:26
two issues there's one where is it going
82:28
to
82:29
where is it ultimately going to
82:31
remain when it does come into some
82:33
new new paradigm normalization i think
82:37
this global rgb rg in terms of supply
82:40
chains
82:41
people reestablishing their models
82:43
and the sort of
82:45
deglobalization is going to continue for
82:47
several years probably three to five
82:49
years so it's going to be a
82:51
period of time where inflation is going
82:53
to be very volatile so the issue isn't
82:54
inflation's going to remain high the
82:56
issue is where it's going to reset will
82:58
it reset around two percent which has
83:00
been the fed target or or higher than
83:02
that so that's what we should be
83:04
focusing on
83:05
axel
83:06
um combination of a and b except for b i
83:09
don't believe we had for
83:11
stagflation i think we'll see continue
83:13
to grow we're going up to our old
83:14
project growth trajectories but
83:17
in my view there is some structural
83:19
elements that are not just transitory or
83:21
temporary and i think we will have
83:24
uncomfortably high rates of inflation
83:26
for you know uh one two three years like
83:29
that uh then it really depends
83:31
on policy because if you assume as in a
83:34
that monetary policy and government
83:35
spending remains extremely expansionary
83:39
then i think we get more structural
83:40
problems that we run into but if they do
83:42
their job and normalize policies and
83:44
normalize spending coming out of the
83:46
crisis move to a more normal mode of
83:48
operation it can be
83:51
more short-lived but i think it really
83:53
depends on you know how these leavers
83:55
are moved in the next years
83:56
i'm not sure if we have the results of
83:58
our poll i'm sure they'll come up in a
83:59
moment and we'll be able to see how all
84:01
of you in this room here we go
84:04
do you agree with our panel
84:05
well our panel had mixed views and so do
84:07
you
84:08
there we go
84:10
um
84:12
again i'm going to make reference to the
84:13
old paradigm we could call it the old
84:14
global business model and
84:17
make an assertion that it was guided by
84:19
a singular goal profit
84:22
and there's something of a consensus
84:23
emerging today that the pursuit of
84:25
profit not only isn't enough
84:28
but also explains why the old business
84:31
model is variously destroying the planet
84:34
creating larger wealth gaps and not
84:36
delivering on the promise of shared
84:37
prosperity axel even if you don't agree
84:41
that there will be a new paradigm does
84:43
there need to be a new sense of purpose
84:46
for the global
84:48
business
84:49
i think global business needs
84:52
to really focus on not creating
84:53
externalities like pollution and global
84:56
warming and so clearly the cost of doing
84:58
business globally in
85:00
bringing that back to levels that are
85:02
sustainable uh will have
85:05
much increased cost levels so i'm with
85:07
pierce there will be a lot of green
85:09
inflation in a lot of things we do and
85:12
it will hit consumers and it will also
85:14
you know just a stark reminder we're
85:16
talking about distribution and whether
85:17
there's inequality in uh in our
85:20
societies it's not a new phenomenon
85:22
remember the communist party just had
85:24
its 100th anniversary in china marx marx
85:27
and lenin have been uh sort of ver a
85:29
hundred years ago transform
85:32
forming political uh views in europe uh
85:34
so look everything repeats it just comes
85:36
back in shorter or longer cycle so i'm
85:39
not that excited about it we'll get on
85:40
top of these problems so i don't think
85:43
we're in a new world we just see more
85:45
morphing of the old world into something
85:47
that looks different but it's the same
85:49
underlying thing i sort of think
85:52
we have to keep in mind this is i think
85:53
the 50th anniversary of uh milton
85:56
friedman's sort of definition of the
85:58
purpose of the corporation and
86:00
maximizing profit if you actually read
86:02
that article carefully it's purpose of
86:05
corporations to maximize profit common
86:08
comma all things considered which
86:11
gets into this logic that axel is
86:14
referring to in terms of what i call
86:15
stakeholder capitalism which means the
86:17
broader purview and i think we're now
86:19
living in an environment where people
86:22
are
86:23
and you see this now with the recent
86:25
chinese plenum and you also see this
86:27
with the big american corporations
86:29
they're more focused not
86:32
on maximizing profit but what i call
86:34
stable growth and stable growth doesn't
86:37
imply volatility and growth it implies
86:39
managed growth over a period of time
86:41
because they're looking at more
86:42
long-term r d and they've got a number
86:45
of objectives so i think you're seeing a
86:47
shift from
86:48
more volatile growth just more
86:52
projected stable growth in the developed
86:54
world but also and that's one of the
86:55
things the chinese are equally focused
86:57
on
86:59
there's a relevant question from the
87:00
audience here given that the given the
87:03
impressive job done by the private
87:05
sector you mentioned the stacey to
87:06
develop vaccines and record time given
87:09
that it required public investment
87:12
and facilitation do we also need an
87:14
operation warp speed
87:16
to rapidly develop new technologies to
87:18
address the climate crisis
87:20
well it didn't all require uh
87:22
a public investment i mean pfizer no
87:24
there was made that decision on
87:26
themselves right so i think that there
87:27
is that opportunity i do believe though
87:29
that there is a place for the government
87:32
to work together with the private sector
87:34
in a constructive way less adversarial
87:36
so we can that we can advance those
87:38
initiatives and
87:39
i think it's i think it's really
87:41
important and when we think about
87:42
oh i just lost my train of thought i'll
87:43
let you go
87:45
well let me pick up on that i think r d
87:47
is important and oftentimes uh you know
87:50
when the farm industry
87:52
the private sector has rnd you take the
87:54
internet a last part of that was done by
87:55
darpa and the defense administration and
87:58
then post you know poured out so there's
88:00
some areas where rnd as an example uh
88:02
the public sector can play critical or
88:04
in singapore we have an agency called a
88:06
star we have an r d budget of about 21
88:08
22 billion dollars for every five year
88:10
period and we along with participation
88:13
private sector figure where to put those
88:15
dollars to work and a substantial amount
88:17
of it is now going in things about you
88:18
know how do you think about nature based
88:19
solutions greening the economy creating
88:22
institutes of learning uh driving the
88:24
education agenda on some of these
88:25
subjects so i think the public sector
88:27
can play a role and they're not in
88:28
conflict you know it can be a commercial
88:30
opportunity and to be focused on profit
88:32
and to be focused on long-term growth
88:34
and stable growth and that's the
88:36
environment i believe we should be
88:38
fostering when i think about some of the
88:40
decisions we've made in our own business
88:42
just looking back through time in 2003
88:44
we're investing in environmental markets
88:46
uh with the climate exchange that we
88:48
acquired in 2010 because of we thought
88:50
the importance of the
88:52
that work and also the commercial
88:53
opportunities that we predicted we were
88:55
going to see from that same logic when
88:56
we announced our launch of natural asset
88:58
companies which provides an opportunity
89:00
for investors to invest in the natural
89:02
resources that we want to see become
89:05
nature positive so that we can have a
89:06
positive influence that's a commercial
89:08
opportunity it's also a successful
89:12
endeavor for all of us and mankind and i
89:15
i believe strongly we should be
89:16
fostering those those projects one of
89:18
the things eric i think we've got to be
89:20
following on what's what stacy has said
89:22
is
89:23
there's a
89:24
the whole esg area has been
89:27
managed with the pr point of view as
89:29
being very negative it's everything is
89:32
what i call negative sg negative
89:33
climates everything is you can't
89:35
obviously you've got to constrain coal
89:37
you've got to constrain carbon you've
89:38
got to constrain methane but let's be on
89:41
the
89:41
offensive side there's an extraordinary
89:44
number of industries the green
89:47
industries which are not given enough
89:49
attention they're not given enough
89:50
profile
89:52
any of them are not in america which is
89:53
probably why they're not given enough
89:54
profile many of them are in europe or in
89:56
asia and particularly in china
89:58
where there's a big growing business so
90:02
i think we need to figure out broader
90:04
policies to make sure that these
90:06
companies are given
90:07
stacey more profile more capital
90:10
more opportunities
90:12
to expand and really set aside given
90:15
incentives tax incentives or other
90:17
incentives more than what we have now in
90:19
order to grow because this is
90:21
this is going to take the industrial
90:23
revolution took a long time this is
90:25
going to take a long time and we've got
90:27
to transition this this isn't about
90:29
turning off
90:30
hydrocarbons
90:32
turning this on because this is still
90:34
very nascent we need to sort of but we
90:36
need to focus on the positive side of
90:39
where the investment is needs to be
90:41
actually part of the investment actually
90:43
is on what you said john it is the
90:44
transition yeah you got to get
90:46
industries to move from brown to light
90:48
brown light brown to light green and
90:50
light green to green it's not going to
90:51
go
90:52
one to the other so it's a trillion
90:54
dollar opportunity absolutely
90:56
you started your comments in this
90:58
conversation talking about
91:01
how we run the world
91:03
and um the need for activist governments
91:07
the rise of crypto
91:10
embodies a mistrust of
91:12
institutions especially monetary
91:14
institutions and governments and it
91:17
embodies the collective desire for
91:19
the decentralization
91:21
of financial power how in the context of
91:24
this conversation do you
91:26
think about
91:27
decentralization and tools like
91:30
cryptocurrency well
91:31
[Music]
91:33
that's the challenge i alluded to so you
91:34
know maybe not in this room but if you
91:36
talk to any young kid today you talk to
91:38
the technocrats you talk to the
91:40
evangelist
91:42
they will tell you that the future of
91:43
the world is self-sovereign 8 billion
91:45
people each of us can be sovereign we
91:47
have our own identity it is tokenized my
91:49
data is my own my interactions are
91:52
our own i will deal smart contracts i
91:54
will have my own currency so in web 2
91:56
2-0 the big risk was due
91:59
debate between the kingdom of facebook
92:00
versus the kingdom of sweden in web 3-0
92:03
it's not even that is it do you each
92:05
become and self-sovereign identity and
92:07
work with that and believe me there's
92:10
hundreds of millions of people who think
92:11
that
92:12
the future and which way i say it's a
92:14
massive paradigm shift we're good to
92:16
think no i don't believe that will
92:17
happen i think there is a lot vested in
92:19
cultural identities nation states what
92:21
we built you know the best failing
92:22
democracy so i don't think it will
92:24
happen but it will require us to think
92:26
very hard on how do we construct a
92:28
system where a large number of people
92:30
think i don't need a government i don't
92:31
need a currency i don't need a fair
92:33
currency i don't need a bank i don't
92:35
need a central bank i don't need a stock
92:36
exchange so how do you balance these two
92:38
and create the artifacts that you need
92:41
to run the world in the future is that
92:42
right axel i want you to jump in here
92:44
you've run institutions on the public
92:45
and the private side
92:47
what do you think
92:48
well look uh you asked about crypto uh
92:51
it's
92:52
the hybrid and people usually talk about
92:54
the hybrid instead of the details we
92:57
really like the technology behind that
92:59
blockchain technology distributed ledger
93:01
we do a lot of that trade finance as
93:03
banks with that the crypto part is where
93:06
i'm skeptical because the whole idea is
93:09
let's sort of move payments from banks
93:11
and
93:12
cash to something that is an anonymous
93:14
vehicle where both sides of the
93:16
transactions are not known that will not
93:17
survive the only part where you had that
93:20
in the old paradigm was banknotes
93:23
governments have phased out large
93:25
denomination banknotes because they
93:27
didn't want large transactions with no
93:30
fingerprint and no id on it
93:33
and crypto trying to do that in digital
93:34
is going to be jumped up on by
93:36
government as much in the traditional
93:38
world was as it will be in in the sort
93:41
of digital world so i love the
93:43
technology i think the idea of having
93:46
you know instantaneous transaction
93:48
between a large number of people
93:50
fantastic but
93:53
i think it needs to have a kyc know your
93:55
client an aml procedure around it
93:57
otherwise it will not survive
93:58
governments are working hard to avoid
94:01
illegal activities that could be done
94:03
through transaction in financial sphere
94:06
and governments will not tolerate this
94:07
to become really big the regulation will
94:09
definitely follow and governments are
94:10
definitely going to get involved
94:13
the revolution that drove crypto i think
94:15
gets to john's point about the
94:16
individuals saying hey the system
94:18
doesn't work for me you know they feel
94:19
left out and that that decentralization
94:22
if we don't address those underlying
94:23
themes of individuals not feeling part
94:26
of the framework that we've created
94:27
we're going to see that that conflict
94:30
continue
94:33
whether we define it as a new paradigm
94:35
or
94:36
an evolution of the old paradigm i think
94:38
you all have a much better sense of what
94:40
the world we're living in today looks
94:42
like and what more importantly what it's
94:44
going to look like in the days the weeks
94:46
the months and years ahead
94:47
please join me in thanking our panel
94:50
[Applause]
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heart
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so
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do
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do
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[Applause]
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so
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so
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so
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foreign
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so
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so
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so
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so
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[Laughter]
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so
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[Laughter]
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hmm
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um
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so
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so
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so
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our program will begin in five minutes
126:08
please make your way to your seat
126:14
[Music]
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foreign
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please take your seats our program will
129:26
begin shortly
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[Applause]
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please welcome to the stage blimbag
131:02
editor-in-chief john michaelthwaite
131:05
[Music]
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hello
131:20
it's my great
131:22
pleasure to welcome hopefully on a
131:23
screen
131:25
in front of me here um henry kissinger
131:28
to ask him questions
131:29
on your behalf so hopefully henry is
131:31
going to appear
131:37
i can hear your voice henry
131:39
uh welcome to the new economy forum
131:41
thank you again for talking to us
131:43
i know how much you tried to get here
131:46
um
131:47
i was going to begin
131:49
by
131:50
asking you about the last physical
131:53
meeting
131:54
that we had at the newark
131:56
economy forum in 2019
131:59
you warned us about being in the
132:00
foothills of a new cold war with china
132:04
and then in the last virtual version of
132:07
this you told me
132:08
that you thought we had reached the high
132:10
mountain passes
132:12
that was back in the days of donald
132:14
trump
132:16
since then of of course we have had the
132:18
biden presidency and i think it'd be
132:20
fair to say that the first
132:22
period of the biden presidency was one
132:24
of
132:25
increased tensions with china
132:28
but over the past week
132:30
we have seen in a sense kind of come
132:32
down the mountain we had the
132:35
deal
132:37
to do with climate at cop and now we've
132:39
had this conversation between president
132:41
xi and president biden
132:42
which as wang shi-shan said earlier was
132:45
sort of there were common understandings
132:47
and i suppose my bait my first question
132:50
for you is
132:51
are we
132:52
beginning to come down the mountain or
132:54
do you still see this as a
132:56
as a relationship heading in the wrong
132:58
direction
133:00
i'd say
133:02
we're through the mountain paths
133:05
on
133:06
a precipice
133:08
from which you can look
133:10
in both directions
133:13
and now it depends
133:17
which direction is chosen
133:20
being on the edge of a precipice is
133:22
never normally a good start but all the
133:23
same on the on the necessary
133:26
conditions for us to start coming down
133:29
the mountain so to speak what do you
133:31
think
133:32
america needs to do
133:35
what does joe biden need to do to help
133:37
change this relationship if he wants to
133:39
do
133:42
that i think
133:46
both sides
133:48
have to
133:51
accept
133:53
adapt the view
133:55
that they can't
133:57
between
133:58
major
133:59
technical powers
134:02
of
134:04
comparable capacities
134:07
must not occur
134:10
for the preservation of humanity
134:13
and they therefore have to decide
134:18
that they will attempt
134:21
to
134:22
compose their differences
134:26
to a level in which coexistence
134:30
becomes
134:31
not only possible
134:33
but essential
134:38
i think the conversations this weekend
134:43
last few days
134:45
were a good
134:47
beginning
134:49
of this statement
134:51
of a possible mood
134:55
they now have to
134:57
be followed
134:58
by concrete discussions
135:01
that lead in the direction
135:04
both presidents
135:06
have affirmed they want to pursue
135:10
where do you see america in that just to
135:12
push you on that do you think that
135:14
america is committed
135:18
to a better relationship with china or
135:19
do you think it still sees it as a
135:21
strategic rival
135:22
what is your impression of the biden
135:24
administration
135:27
it is
135:28
inherent
135:30
it's indian and in the
135:33
technology and economic
135:37
economy of each side
135:39
that countries will consider
135:42
each other
135:43
as competitors
135:46
and public opinion in the united states
135:49
has
135:51
moved
135:53
into the direction of looking at china
135:58
as a rival
136:01
the
136:02
necessity
136:03
for both sides
136:05
is to see
136:08
whether from that posture
136:11
they can move towards
136:14
a pattern
136:17
in which
136:19
disputes
136:21
are attempting to be
136:23
mitigated
136:25
and in which they realize
136:28
that a victor
136:30
is not possible
136:32
without a risk of destroying humanity
136:38
on that particular thing are there
136:40
particular areas
136:43
that you would want to see america and
136:45
for that matter china concentrating on
136:47
we have seen
136:48
the progress on climate
136:50
but are there other areas other
136:52
opportunities that you can see
136:55
where there is room
136:57
for cooperation
137:00
well there has been
137:04
some progress made
137:06
on
137:07
climate change
137:10
and there is a whole range
137:15
of technically
137:17
dudes
137:18
in which cooperation
137:21
between the two sides
137:24
could bring
137:25
could bring
137:26
benefit
137:29
and
137:31
there is there are also
137:35
tensions in the world
137:38
in which cooperation between china and
137:40
the united states
137:42
say on nuclear proliferation
137:47
is of the
137:49
greatest
137:50
of the greatest importance
137:54
so
137:55
there are many topics
137:58
which it is at least important
138:02
to begin to
138:03
see
138:05
whether the views of the two sides
138:08
are sufficiently compatible to permit
138:10
cooperation
138:12
and if there's
138:14
if that is not possible
138:18
how to prevent them from
138:20
from moving
138:21
towards
138:22
conflict are you convinced on the about
138:26
the china's good intentions in this i
138:28
mean if you talk to a lot of people in
138:30
in the united states or indeed in the
138:33
west they will say that china is not
138:36
is bent on becoming a bigger power and
138:40
that america and other things are in its
138:41
way it wants to go its own way it is
138:43
merely biding its time
138:46
do you see the current
138:48
chinese regime which you know well
138:50
do you see that as one which does want
138:52
that degree of cooperation that you've
138:54
just spoken about
138:59
my task as a student of foreign policy
139:03
is not primarily to a psychoanalysis
139:06
the chinese
139:08
regime
139:11
i assume
139:13
that chinese leaders will work
139:16
towards
139:17
the maximum capability of their country
139:21
our task as americans and
139:24
non-chinese
139:26
is to
139:28
understand what we need to do
139:31
to make sure that there is
139:34
at least equivalence
139:36
and
139:37
in no case
139:39
subordination
139:41
if we understand that and if the chinese
139:44
understand their interests
139:48
as i believe they are
139:51
very capable of
139:53
then it should be possible to make
139:55
arrangements
139:58
by which the level of competition
140:01
is reduced to a point
140:03
that makes
140:05
even cooperative measures
140:07
possible
140:09
i'm assuming i'm
140:11
assuming
140:13
that china will operate at a high level
140:17
of its capacity
140:19
because that is the confusion tradition
140:22
and an engineering in chinese history
140:26
it is our obligation to work at an
140:28
equivalent level of capacity
140:32
and then
140:33
to
140:35
ask ourselves
140:38
whether the world will not be better off
140:41
if we
140:42
deal with the outstanding issues
140:46
like climate change
140:49
like
140:50
artificial intelligence
140:54
like
140:55
economic relationships
140:58
from the point of view that leads to
141:00
benefit for both sides
141:05
i would imagine that after 60 70 years
141:07
you might have graduated from a student
141:09
to a to at least an undergraduate in in
141:12
analyzing the chinese
141:13
administration but i wondered what
141:18
what role is there in this for europe
141:21
i mean it's interesting in this debate
141:23
here it's a word one barely he has
141:25
mentioned yet it is still the european
141:27
union is still the world's biggest
141:29
economy
141:30
what role does europe have in this
141:33
geopolitics
141:38
for my generation of american thinkers
141:41
the relationship with europe has been a
141:43
central feature
141:45
of american foreign policy
141:47
and the atlantic partnership is of
141:50
crucial importance
141:53
but the
141:54
problems of the atlantic partnership
141:56
that
141:58
it was formed
141:59
had to do
142:01
on the whole
142:02
with russian challenges
142:05
now the chinese challenges
142:09
are of a different cultural and
142:12
substantive nature
142:14
than the ones that were opposed by
142:19
the european
142:20
embargo
142:22
so
142:24
we cannot automatically
142:26
apply
142:27
all the legends of europe
142:29
to the
142:31
conditions of asia
142:33
but i would expect that in a general
142:36
sense
142:38
europe would look at america's
142:41
problems in other parts of the world
142:44
with sympathy
142:46
and with understanding
142:48
and that we in turn will understand that
142:51
on
142:52
some specific issues
142:55
the europeans because of
142:58
different geography
143:00
history and economy
143:02
might have special concerns
143:04
but the overall lines of policy
143:08
it should
143:09
be
143:10
that europe
143:12
and the united states co-op
143:15
cooperate
143:18
with allowances
143:20
for special conditions
143:22
that may exist
143:24
by country or region
143:27
can i ask you about one thing which i
143:28
know has obsessed you over the past
143:30
couple of years
143:32
artificial intelligence you have a book
143:34
on the age of ai and it is a
143:37
it
143:38
is a large part of the competition
143:41
between china and america in your book
143:43
you describe ai as the biggest change in
143:46
human thinking
143:48
since the enlightenment given given that
143:50
importance
143:51
how do you see the contest between us
143:54
and china
143:55
in terms of artificial intelligence
144:00
well
144:01
federal artificial intelligence
144:04
is a departure in human thinking
144:08
comparable to that which reduce the
144:10
enlightenment
144:12
so a whole new school of
144:15
intellectual evolution
144:18
is bound to develop
144:21
when the results
144:24
are achieved
144:26
by
144:28
achieving a result
144:30
without exactly knowing what the reason
144:33
for it is
144:35
but knowing that it is produced
144:38
by
144:39
an algorithmic understanding
144:42
of events that is a huge change in
144:46
human thinking
144:48
now
144:49
china has the same
144:52
challenge
144:54
how to adjust its thinking to this
144:58
reality
144:59
now if we deal with this entirely in
145:03
entirely competitive terms
145:05
and if we try to determine
145:07
who is superior and if we don't even
145:11
know how to define
145:14
a level what a level of superiority
145:18
is which is strategically youthful
145:22
we could be engaging in a rates which
145:25
as a result of accidents
145:28
leads to consequences
145:31
which we cannot foresee
145:33
so i would hope
145:36
that a way will be found
145:38
by which
145:40
technological discussions between the
145:42
two sides take place
145:44
which permit also an adjustment
145:47
of economic competition
145:50
neither side will accept
145:52
a
145:54
permanently inferior
145:56
understanding
145:59
but both sides have to understand
146:02
that the other will not concede a
146:04
permanently superior standing
146:07
so a dialogue that starts from these
146:09
realities
146:12
is essential
146:13
and there can be
146:15
no
146:16
winners
146:19
in an ai race
146:21
if both sides
146:23
do what they need to do
146:26
can i push you on one particular last
146:28
thing to do with that you mentioned
146:30
nuclear
146:32
conflict before you were involved
146:34
obviously in the talks with the soviet
146:37
union
146:38
about that in your book and in
146:40
conversation you have made the point
146:42
that cyber warfare is completely
146:44
different
146:45
because firstly it is harder for people
146:49
to say exactly what they have because
146:51
often that is giving away competitive
146:53
advantage
146:54
but also the bigger idea that we now
146:56
have computers which in order to fight
146:58
each other
146:59
should operate almost without human
147:01
control
147:03
is there a
147:04
a kind of organization or a governing
147:07
principle that america and china should
147:09
join in on this is there
147:11
a way in which you could have a modern
147:13
version of of disarmament
147:18
logic of cyber warfare
147:21
is
147:23
to operate at a speed
147:26
which is beyond human capacity
147:29
and therefore the temptation is
147:31
to build automatic responses
147:35
into weapon systems
147:37
but
147:39
if you deprive these issues
147:42
of any human element
147:45
then the danger
147:46
check the disaster
147:48
systems
147:49
might make
147:51
a judgment which you didn't foresee
147:54
and the danger of an automatic conflict
147:58
creation
148:00
have become very great
148:03
so how to build human judgment
148:05
into
148:06
cyber
148:08
confrontations
148:09
and how to solve the problem that these
148:13
types of weapons
148:15
are usually kept very secret within each
148:18
country
148:19
so to expose them to discussion with a
148:22
foreign country is not a matter that has
148:25
been
148:26
ever done
148:28
before
148:29
but without it
148:31
it will not be possible
148:33
to achieve meaningful restraints
148:36
but
148:37
peace
148:39
strain these attempts to achieve
148:41
restraints
148:42
must not become a way
148:44
of intelligence exploitation so much
148:48
as a way of
148:50
it or at all
148:51
but as a way of looking at a
148:55
novel
148:59
elemental change
149:01
in human cognition which is now
149:05
imposed on us
149:07
to deal with
149:09
and
149:10
a few hundred years ago
149:12
the german philosopher khan said
149:16
the road
149:16
predicted
149:19
that
149:20
peace would be achieved at some point in
149:23
human history
149:24
either by human insight
149:26
or by catastrophes of a magnitude that
149:30
will permit no other choice
149:32
we are exactly that point
149:35
in our
149:37
conduct
149:39
and the responsibility of our leaders
149:43
is
149:44
to try to fulfill it
149:46
and i must say i think the dialogue has
149:50
begun
149:51
on an appropriate level
149:54
appropriate to the challenge
149:59
because
150:00
thank you very much for talking to us um
150:02
you put us on a precipice and you ended
150:04
up with immanuel kant
150:05
but thank you very much um and all thank
150:07
you very much also for being our
150:09
co-chairman you are much missed
150:11
thank you for staying up um late to do
150:14
this
150:14
and we will see you next year
150:17
thank you
150:19
[Applause]
150:30
[Music]
151:05
[Music]
151:21
[Music]
151:29
[Music]
151:36
[Music]
151:54
[Music]
152:03
please welcome a moderator bloomberg
152:05
television anchor sharian and her
152:07
panelists vice president of the united
152:10
republic of tanzania his excellency dr
152:12
philip isdo and pango
152:14
ceo and founder of asa finance elizabeth
152:17
rozier
152:20
president and ceo of paypal dan shulman
152:23
and senior minister of the republic of
152:25
singapore taraman shem garathnam
152:42
good morning
152:44
thank you very much for joining us today
152:47
the title of this session is the
152:49
two-speed global recovery the dangers of
152:52
a widening rich poor gap of course
152:55
for the past few decades we have seen
152:57
the global economy
152:58
converge with lower income countries
153:01
catching up to wealthier ones thanks to
153:03
capital the advance of technology but it
153:06
seems the pandemic has reversed that
153:08
trend
153:09
so we are now seeing
153:11
the imf warn of a dangerous divergence
153:15
we are seeing of course this being
153:16
exacerbated by the
153:19
great vaccine divide more than 90 of
153:21
populations in lower income countries
153:23
are still unvaccinated
153:25
so this panel
153:27
will try to tackle those issues to see
153:30
where we're at in the state of the
153:32
global recovery and of course how we can
153:34
heal
153:36
really the biggest scars of the pandemic
153:39
and try to ensure an equitable recovery
153:42
we have an amazing lineup of guests
153:45
thank you very much for joining us today
153:47
first of all his excellency dr philip
153:49
israel pongo vice president
153:51
of the united republic of tanzania
153:54
elizabeth rosiello who's the ceo and
153:56
founder of as of finance
154:00
also dan shulman president and ceo of
154:01
paypal and of course
154:03
tarman ratnam senior minister and
154:06
chairman of the monetary authority of
154:08
singapore welcome to you all and thank
154:09
you very much for being here with us
154:12
let's start with the state of the global
154:14
recovery because as i mentioned we have
154:16
seen this rich and poor divide just
154:19
become more persistent during the
154:21
pandemic become more evident
154:24
let me start with you mr vice president
154:26
what are you seeing in terms of the
154:28
global economic recovery
154:30
and the inequalities that we're seeing
154:32
within nations
154:33
within tanzania around the world among
154:36
nations as well
154:41
well first
154:42
thank you for the opportunity to be here
154:46
this is a great chance for us
154:48
in sub-saharan africa
154:51
to share with the world
154:52
the experiences we are having
154:55
with the pandemic
155:00
well first what we see is a
155:03
very sluggish recovery
155:05
but very uneven
155:08
and
155:09
it is sluggish particularly for
155:13
countries like tanzania
155:16
where to start with we had very weak
155:20
public health systems
155:23
and therefore we really took a hard
155:25
knock
155:27
having to struggle with
155:30
very
155:31
nascent
155:34
health facilities
155:36
we had to
155:38
convert
155:40
even theaters at some point to be able
155:43
to accommodate
155:46
health patients
155:48
people
155:50
that succumbed to the pandemic
155:54
we had to
155:57
really
155:59
struggle with the related facilities
156:02
oxygen for example my own country has
156:05
only one
156:06
oxygen plant in the whole country of 60
156:09
million people
156:11
and therefore
156:12
uh you you you can guess the
156:15
consequences of having to to struggle
156:18
with all
156:20
150
156:21
000 patients
156:23
but also the unevenness
156:26
comes because
156:28
some families
156:30
lost their loved ones
156:31
and in that case when you lose
156:34
bred eners
156:36
you know the consequences
156:38
you
156:39
throw the entire family in
156:42
in poverty
156:44
i can cite an example where a family in
156:47
three days
156:48
lost the head of the household and the
156:51
mother of the household and both
156:52
professors
156:54
so we have really lost out
156:57
but apart from
157:00
the
157:00
health
157:01
sector effects
157:03
we have had
157:05
a serious knock on the economy
157:08
and the financial sector
157:11
and and here
157:13
tourism for example right as the borders
157:17
closed
157:18
we did
157:20
not receive tourists no airlines were
157:22
coming
157:25
so
157:26
tourist
157:27
operators shut down jobs were lost
157:32
and
157:34
same for trade
157:36
international trade collapsed
157:40
we could not
157:42
import the necessary raw materials
157:45
from our major trading partners china
157:47
india and the like really
157:49
this pandemic has been a very
157:52
tragic
157:54
one for everyone indeed very very tragic
157:57
and
158:00
i think really key here is that
158:04
we ask the advanced world
158:07
not to forget sub-saharan africa
158:10
because the challenge that we see is
158:12
that
158:14
while
158:15
the advanced economies
158:18
are recovering
158:20
relatively fast because they have the
158:22
vaccines we don't have the vaccines
158:26
the facilities that have been availed to
158:28
us
158:29
they're just too little
158:32
and
158:33
the pandemic is global
158:36
on that note let me ask minister tharman
158:40
about your thoughts on how much have
158:42
high income economies done so far faced
158:45
with this crisis and this divergence
158:48
that the vice president is talking about
158:50
well i think the vice the divergence and
158:53
that we know
158:55
in a very sharp sense
158:57
is the divergence in vaccine access
159:00
that's well known
159:01
but i think underpinning it is now a
159:04
gulf that's opened up
159:07
in trust
159:09
between the developing world and the
159:11
advanced world
159:13
a gulf and trust that's opening up even
159:16
within societies
159:20
some societies have come out okay in
159:22
fact there's some societies where trust
159:24
seems to be even stronger than it was
159:26
before kovid because people found a way
159:29
of collaborating with each other for the
159:31
common good
159:32
but the many other societies where
159:34
divisions are just
159:36
sharper than they used to be
159:38
and we see that
159:40
in the news every day
159:42
and trust in institutions
159:45
across the world is now lower than it
159:47
was two years ago it was already
159:48
weakening for some years
159:50
and it's much lower than it used to be
159:53
trust in some governments has held up
159:55
trust in many governments is now weaker
159:57
than it's ever been
159:58
and trust
160:00
and multilateralism
160:02
is at a all-time low
160:04
on all the issues to do with the common
160:06
good right trust and multilateralism or
160:09
even
160:10
pluralism the g20 and other groupings
160:14
uh trust is lower than it used to be
160:16
and we have to be concerned about that
160:18
and it means addressing it
160:20
just through narratives not just through
160:22
saying the right things we need concrete
160:25
collaborative ventures
160:27
whether it's on climate change
160:29
or
160:30
making sure that we can scale up
160:32
backseat production and distribution
160:35
or critically
160:37
looking beyond kovit
160:39
addressing the issues that existed
160:41
before cobit are now are now much more
160:43
accentuated we have a crisis in learning
160:46
the biggest divide in the world by the
160:48
way
160:49
by far the most profound and the most
160:51
dangerous divide we have is in learning
160:53
opportunities
160:57
let's talk a little bit about what's
160:58
going on the ground
161:00
because of course elizabeth you cater to
161:02
frontier markets what are you seeing
161:04
so i would say hope is not all lost it's
161:06
true there's been six million
161:08
vaccinations in nigeria which is a
161:10
population of 206 million um that's
161:14
clear but the entrepreneurial resilience
161:16
of the african continent where i've been
161:18
running this business
161:20
for eight years is unmatched and
161:22
unparalleled and it was during covid
161:24
that we saw the rise of the first
161:26
african unicorns and there are now seven
161:28
unicorns on the continent after a decade
161:30
of being almost zero and all of those
161:32
are in digital businesses and amongst my
161:35
peers on the continent we're used to
161:38
you know epidemics you know the election
161:40
violence we've closed our office our
161:42
offices in nairobi in lagos and dakar 10
161:45
12 times over the last eight years so we
161:47
already had a work from home strategy
161:50
our employees were already completely
161:51
set up you can give an allowance for
161:53
energy or be coming online it was a
161:56
seamless transition so it's almost a
161:58
bifurcation of the
162:00
economy in terms of the traditional
162:02
formal government economy and also the
162:03
informal online youth economy and the
162:06
resilience that we've seen and the
162:08
bounce back has been tremendous and even
162:10
in the the formal financial sector we
162:12
have seen you know record-breaking
162:13
returns for the nigerian banking sector
162:16
just announced and i think what we can
162:18
see is that you know
162:20
um there hasn't been a lot of
162:22
international investment outside of
162:23
international aid on the african
162:25
continent for the last you know few
162:28
years nothing matched with the venture
162:29
or private equity investment so what's
162:32
what what that has mean is that a lot of
162:33
bootstrap companies like aloysius here
162:36
another catalyst
162:38
working a lot of companies that have
162:40
been 10 years without funding that are
162:42
now you know perfectly positioned to
162:44
thrive in this kind of market dan what
162:46
are you seeing on the ground especially
162:47
when it comes to elizabeth talk about
162:49
some dynamism still on the ground
162:52
i think the uh
162:54
pandemic
162:56
exposed as thurman was saying trends
162:58
that have been happening for a long time
163:01
um
163:02
there are
163:03
at least 1.7 billion people throughout
163:06
the world who don't have access to
163:09
financial services i would say you could
163:11
double that that are underserved today a
163:14
hundred million
163:16
incremental people went into extreme
163:18
poverty
163:20
uh during the pandemic um
163:23
and it disproportionately
163:25
has affected um
163:28
women um it's affected uh
163:31
many vulnerable uh populations and so
163:35
this was going on before but the
163:37
pandemic really i think
163:41
cast a a spotlight on it that we cannot
163:43
ignore like we are all a part of our
163:46
communities businesses are a part of
163:48
their communities governments are part
163:51
of not just their own uh country but
163:54
but the rural community and so i think
163:57
the pandemics is going to force
164:00
us to think about how we think about the
164:03
world in general because i think when
164:04
you have such unrest that thurman was
164:07
mentioning his excellency was mentioning
164:10
that threatens the foundations of
164:14
political systems as well so i think
164:16
it's a it's a dangerous time and i i
164:19
think
164:21
uh we need to be sure that there's a
164:22
equal recovery as best we can just a
164:25
reminder for our audience if you have
164:27
any questions you have the nef app so
164:29
you can send us your questions and i'll
164:31
get them here and try to get them
164:33
for you but dan let me just go back to
164:36
your point about of course the pandemic
164:38
really exacerbating some of the
164:40
existing problems like minister thurman
164:42
was saying it's not that we didn't have
164:43
a divide we did but it just worsened the
164:45
situation what about some of the bright
164:47
spots because we also saw this
164:49
acceleration of digitization and perhaps
164:53
really the interconnectedness of the
164:55
world and what is people doing there
164:58
in order to have a recovery
165:01
that includes everyone
165:03
i think clearly the world leapfrogged
165:06
into
165:07
you know
165:08
call it the actually the beginning of
165:10
the digital era uh right now
165:13
um and everything we do the way we work
165:16
the way we live the way we uh get our
165:19
medicine
165:21
the way we uh educate ourselves went
165:23
into a digital realm uh the way we
165:25
finance the way we pay for things went
165:28
uh digital and i think um you know my
165:32
hope
165:33
for this um and the reason
165:36
and i get up every morning and i'm
165:38
excited about what we're trying to
165:41
do inside paypal and working with others
165:43
throughout the ecosystem is that i think
165:45
there is a solution
165:48
rooted in technology i mean everything
165:50
is moving to the mobile phone the mobile
165:52
phone is getting less and less expensive
165:54
you can get a good mobile phone now for
165:56
like 25
165:58
and so it is
166:01
that's connecting us together you have
166:02
all the power of a bank branch in the
166:05
palm of your hand right now and pesa
166:07
taught us that right away and and paypal
166:09
and m-pesa now are interoperable so that
166:12
you can work together and i think
166:14
you if you use the technology you can
166:17
make the managing and moving of money
166:21
faster less expensive and by doing that
166:24
hopefully drive some incremental
166:26
financial health which i think is again
166:29
the bedrock of so many things
166:31
at the same time though i have to wonder
166:33
if it's also going to sort of increase
166:35
the digital divide as well because of
166:37
course we know many
166:39
people in africa
166:41
are still not connected to the internet
166:43
what have you seen mr vice president
166:45
when it comes
166:46
to the pandemic and the acceleration of
166:50
digitization well um
166:54
i i think the gentleman who just spoke
166:57
has it right
166:59
from
167:01
tanzania and the rest of
167:03
the continent
167:05
we really see
167:06
that there is an opportunity
167:08
if the advanced world
167:10
could share with africa
167:13
the digital technologies
167:16
the right from screening
167:19
testing
167:21
and so on and this would
167:24
would make a huge difference for us who
167:26
are still struggling with
167:28
with such facilities but in addition to
167:31
that
167:31
we would need the multilateral
167:33
institutions
167:35
the imf the world bank
167:37
the regional banks
167:39
to come in
167:41
with even more
167:43
financial support
167:45
to really be able to enable sub-saharan
167:49
african countries to access
167:52
and buy these technologies by these
167:56
medicines to fight the pandemic
167:59
so there is an
168:01
opportunities not that
168:03
yes indeed there are challenges in terms
168:05
of
168:06
how fast we can absorb
168:08
digital technologies
168:10
but already africa has
168:13
shown wonders for example in applying
168:16
mobile technologies
168:19
to to reach our
168:21
people in the rural areas and i don't
168:23
see any problem at all that we can catch
168:25
up very easily and
168:27
i think it was said
168:28
the african people are innovative they
168:31
are resilient
168:32
they can match up fairly quickly as long
168:35
as
168:36
the digital technologies are shared with
168:38
us
168:39
elizabeth
168:41
in terms of digital technologies being
168:43
shared across africa what are you seeing
168:44
and what are perhaps some of the
168:46
prospects of new technologies like
168:48
blockchain that could actually
168:50
accelerate some of the progress there
168:52
well i mean honestly we joke about this
168:54
a lot of the company but the internet
168:56
access in kenya is better than in london
168:58
sometimes and you know on our
169:00
i have a house in lama which is in the
169:02
remote northern border of somalia in
169:04
kenya and you have 5g access thanks to
169:06
some mesh networks that were set up by a
169:08
local community so mesh networks have
169:10
been you know 10-year project across
169:13
kenya and we're seeing that all over
169:15
east africa etc similarly when you enter
169:17
the airport in senegal on the other side
169:19
of the continent
169:21
they've had fingerprint access digital
169:23
thermometer readings
169:25
ability to screen for for covid for some
169:27
time now so across the 55 markets you
169:29
see all sorts of levels of digitization
169:31
when we were the first company to
169:33
introduce cryptocurrencies on the
169:34
continent in 2013 which i guess was too
169:37
soon
169:39
we had some bumps along the road but now
169:41
it's quite exciting to see the uptake
169:43
and actually during the last two years
169:45
we've seen so many central banks move
169:47
forward with legislation and policies
169:50
that you know have taken eight years to
169:52
to move forward and in the last two
169:54
years have almost raced to the forefront
169:56
including the introduction of the inira
169:58
in nigeria just last month let's
170:01
talk a little bit about the regulatory
170:02
framework there minister thurman because
170:04
elizabeth what's just saying that
170:05
perhaps they introduced cryptocurrency a
170:07
little bit too soon what are the risks
170:09
of that and i know that you've been
170:11
looking at
170:12
crypto blockchain all from the lens of
170:14
fintech and the opportunities that it
170:16
presents
170:18
well i think we've got to always start
170:20
with the use case what's the objective
170:23
not not what what's the solution but
170:25
what's the objective so dan spoke about
170:27
financial inclusion
170:29
that's a that's a very large use case
170:31
because a large part of the developing
170:33
world still doesn't have financial
170:35
inclusion
170:36
uh even just internet excess right a
170:39
large part of the world rather
170:41
roughly 80 percent in the developing
170:43
world doesn't even have internet access
170:46
a large part
170:48
of
170:49
society even within the advanced world
170:52
doesn't even have internet access
170:55
um
170:55
i'll give you an example and it's really
170:58
worth shining a light on this
171:02
about
171:03
20 percent of sub-saharan africa and a
171:05
good part of the developing world has
171:07
internet access 80 don't
171:11
in detroit
171:12
milwaukee
171:14
baltimore
171:15
it's about 30 percent
171:17
of school growing children
171:19
that live in homes with internet like
171:21
yes
171:23
they're developing countries
171:25
so we've got to shine a light on the
171:26
basic problems and that defines our use
171:29
case
171:30
how do we improve internet access how do
171:33
we get more learning inclusion how do we
171:35
raise standards
171:37
how do we have financial inclusion
171:38
access to credit for smes
171:42
those are the big challenges of the
171:43
world
171:44
not so much the incremental changes in
171:46
costs for cross-border
171:49
uh
171:50
payments and and stuff that's all
171:52
interesting and useful
171:54
but those are small bore
171:56
issues
171:57
the really big challenges are staring at
172:00
us in the face
172:02
inclusion and sustainability are huge
172:05
challenges
172:07
the technologies exist for some of them
172:09
particularly for inclusion
172:11
that technologies are getting there for
172:13
sustainability still not fully bankable
172:16
or investable and we've got to
172:17
accelerate it through a lot more public
172:20
private
172:22
risk sharing it requires risk sharing
172:25
not just um
172:27
support for collaboration it requires
172:30
money to be put
172:32
risk capital to be put in place to share
172:34
risk
172:35
because otherwise the technologies
172:36
aren't going to be in place in time
172:38
for the next decade or next 15 years
172:41
sustainability
172:43
so that's what it takes and i think at
172:45
the end of the day
172:46
if kovit has
172:49
had a benefit
172:52
it is that it has illustrated
172:54
unfortunately in a tragic way but it is
172:56
illustrated that
172:59
collaboration
173:00
internationally
173:03
is far far less costly
173:05
than not collaborating
173:07
and preparing in advance for pandemics
173:11
and other crises
173:14
is going to be far far less costly
173:16
than not preparing
173:19
let's talk a little bit about the
173:21
collaboration and what you mentioned
173:22
about public and private partnerships
173:25
dan how do you use that in order to
173:27
ensure a safe ecosystem and especially
173:29
when it comes to perhaps upgrading the
173:32
broader financial
173:33
[Music]
173:36
system well i think um
173:38
[Music]
173:40
new company
173:43
is an island unto itself um
173:46
i think
173:48
i think the business world is slowly
173:50
but surely recognizing that
173:55
we have multiple stakeholders
173:58
those stakeholders include
174:02
our communities
174:04
include our employees
174:06
they include partnerships with
174:08
governments and regulators and customers
174:12
and
174:13
we need to
174:15
think about what is our purpose as a
174:17
company
174:19
and have
174:21
both profit and purpose work hand in
174:23
hand together um we can't just be about
174:26
making money we need to be about what is
174:28
the impact we can make in the world and
174:31
um and i think
174:33
um some companies are talking about that
174:35
and others are actually doing things
174:38
about that putting
174:39
their products
174:42
putting their
174:43
uh capital to work to look at larger
174:46
things than just the company itself and
174:49
i think that um
174:51
each of us have our own impact to make
174:53
uh we've got to do it in partnership
174:55
together there's no way that paypal can
174:58
make an impact without working with
175:00
people like his excellency and the
175:03
senior minister and others around the
175:05
world we have to work hand in hand
175:07
together regulations need to
175:09
permit uh responsible innovation uh to
175:13
happen
175:14
um but there are so many things that we
175:16
can do when we put our mind together for
175:18
instance like we do
175:20
these
175:22
working capital loans um these working
175:24
capital loans go to
175:26
the
175:27
70 of
175:29
uh states in the in the u.s where 10 or
175:32
more banks have closed branches which
175:34
are under-represented neighborhoods
175:36
and
175:37
70 of our loans go there and it's
175:40
because we use
175:42
technology we use different things and
175:44
traditional fico scores and that kind of
175:46
thing to really think about how can our
175:48
products help these underserved
175:51
communities that's part and parcel of
175:53
our mission and part and parcel of what
175:55
our values are as a company and i think
175:57
if all of us can lean into this
176:00
there are ways that
176:02
we can help in all parts of the world i
176:04
think the impact can be profound we just
176:07
can't think about it as like we can only
176:09
do this we have to think about it in its
176:10
totality that the impact
176:14
could be quite substantial if we do that
176:16
elizabeth
176:18
i couldn't agree more and one example is
176:20
that we process for 35 of the largest
176:23
remittance companies in the world and
176:25
remittances are essential to the growth
176:27
of the african continent and it's not
176:29
just the transaction costs most
176:31
remittance companies struggle with
176:33
accessing last mile with accessing float
176:36
pre-funding treasury these might seem
176:38
like you know esoteric ideas but it's
176:40
it's
176:42
actually opens up the flows of that 34
176:44
billion coming into the continent and
176:46
without fintechs without technology
176:48
companies to do the hard work of
176:50
building into those apis digitizing the
176:52
last mile connecting the mobile money
176:54
like empassa like mtn like
176:57
like airtel bartek into the banks and
176:59
the banks into them and to the cash
177:01
networks that's when we get that
177:03
seamless layer and then development
177:05
money private sector money can flow but
177:07
until we get that infrastructure built
177:09
it's really a bottleneck to a lot of
177:11
growth i worked for five years in
177:12
microfinance across the continents and i
177:15
saw this huge bottleneck into accessing
177:17
funds right and the second part is about
177:19
the use of the dollar so a lot of the
177:22
funds distributed across the african
177:24
continent are still distributed in u.s
177:26
dollars and then on lens and local
177:28
currency causing it a huge fx mismatch
177:30
which is something that needs to be
177:32
addressed i can just build on that
177:34
international remittances are one of the
177:36
most important inflows into certain
177:38
economies
177:39
and traditionally the
177:42
international remittance the fees for
177:44
that can be up to eight percent if you
177:47
go digital wallet to digital wallet you
177:50
can do that at 80 percent reduce cost
177:53
that when you look at the flows that
177:55
that go um in international minutes it's
177:58
a huge number getting money to those who
178:02
most need it mr vice president what's
178:04
your view on what's being said right now
178:06
and let me just also add to that a
178:08
question from our audience who's asking
178:11
the challenges have been highlighted but
178:13
what are the opportunities for emerging
178:15
economies and the reason that i'm
178:17
putting those two together is because at
178:18
the end of the day
178:21
you can
178:22
support developing economies but you
178:24
also need that private capital to flow
178:26
by itself and how do you make yourself
178:28
more
178:30
attractive well
178:32
first before that
178:36
i wanted to follow up again on the
178:38
technology issue
178:40
i think there are
178:42
simple things that we really need to
178:45
to work on
178:47
one of the issues which concern us
178:50
in tanzania
178:52
is the whole issue of having
178:54
a responsible social media
178:58
so for example
179:00
uh instead of
179:03
giving a balanced view on the vaccines
179:06
some of these social medias
179:08
are really talking about you know the
179:11
results
179:12
in making people important
179:16
you know they cause sudden death and
179:18
that kind of
179:20
and in the rural setting
179:22
even in urban areas it is very difficult
179:25
for ordinary people to basically say
179:28
this information on the social media is
179:31
incorrect
179:32
that kind of information
179:36
is the right one and therefore for
179:38
example the
179:40
the phobia we are seeing on
179:42
vaccines partly stems from what i think
179:45
is irresponsible social media and
179:49
both of us have a responsibility to make
179:52
sure that we are educating
179:55
our populations and giving them
179:58
the right
179:59
the right information to be able to
180:02
fight
180:04
this pandemic right
180:05
but also let me
180:07
add that
180:09
i think i would like to see
180:12
the developed world
180:15
supporting us
180:16
in what i see as positive the positive
180:19
side the opportunities
180:22
that i have arose from
180:24
uh from kovid coffee 19.
180:27
for example there are some industries
180:29
that are now coming up
180:31
to produce sanitizers and that kind of
180:35
and
180:35
i think it is important that we provide
180:38
incentives
180:39
to those industries
180:42
using fiscal policies internally but
180:46
also facilitating
180:48
trade
180:49
importation of various inputs that
180:52
go into into into such
180:55
into such industries but even more
180:58
important i think i would like to see
181:01
the
181:02
diverse world cooperating with us on r d
181:06
and in terms of
181:08
some could relocate
181:10
some of the
181:12
the industries manufacturing the
181:14
vaccines for example to the african
181:16
continent they can work with our local
181:19
researchers
181:20
to push
181:22
the knowledge of frontier so
181:25
i think there are ways in which
181:27
if we work together
181:29
we can defeat this pandemic
181:32
fairly uh fairly quickly as compared to
181:36
now that yes
181:38
we are innovative we are resilient
181:41
uh
181:42
depending on the circumstances we are in
181:44
for example in tanzania we decided not
181:46
to
181:47
go for a total lockdown
181:49
because for a population that really
181:51
depends on
181:52
you know a daily
181:54
subsistence way of life
181:57
if you close them you go for a total
181:59
lockdown it's almost imposing on
182:02
omega's chamber which we couldn't do
182:05
so yes there are
182:07
solutions that we can
182:09
push for it's not just the effects
182:12
we are perfectly capable of finding
182:15
solutions to
182:16
move ahead
182:18
minister thurman let me ask you a
182:20
longer-term question of course
182:22
of course when it comes to the broader
182:24
international financial system what can
182:26
we learn from this pandemic
182:28
when it comes to building a sustainable
182:30
uh environment where we do all see
182:33
opportunities for everyone
182:35
so first by the way i should say that i
182:36
agree entirely with what elizabeth and
182:38
dan were saying about remittances
182:40
so don't get me wrong
182:43
the cost of financial inclusion is a
182:44
serious issue and remittances are
182:47
a significant part of earnings for a
182:49
large part of the population in the
182:51
developing world so reducing the cost of
182:53
that is a very good thing
182:55
um on your broader question i would say
182:58
and this touches on what dr ambango just
183:00
said
183:03
to be
183:04
honest about it
183:06
if we try to tackle a pandemic after it
183:08
is started
183:11
it is very costly and it's going to take
183:13
a very long time
183:15
and that's what we've learned in covid
183:17
speed and scale is everything
183:20
and if you start only after
183:22
pentamic has broken out
183:25
even with the best efforts and the best
183:27
private enterprise and the most
183:29
remarkable speed of vaccine development
183:32
we're still in a situation where
183:34
20 months on
183:35
the majority of the world's population
183:37
hasn't had a jab in their arms so we
183:40
have to prepare beforehand and that's
183:44
a huge lesson coming out of corvit 19.
183:47
we must have ahead of time
183:49
manufacturing and distribution
183:51
capabilities
183:53
ahead of time
183:54
and there's no way the private sector or
183:56
the markets are going to deliver that
183:58
first they don't know exactly which
184:00
pathogen is going to be
184:01
the
184:03
source of the pandemic they don't know
184:04
which vaccine is going to succeed and
184:06
get through phase 3 trials so it
184:08
requires public private collaboration in
184:11
a much deeper sense
184:13
to be honest the us did it quite well
184:17
the us through bada and that whole
184:19
combination of government agencies did
184:21
it quite well
184:24
it was developed over the years
184:27
in the last year and a half
184:29
in an almost un-american way
184:31
government did well
184:33
in the us
184:35
even the us army was involved
184:37
in the logistics right
184:40
and we need to have a global bada
184:44
that's what we need
184:45
to develop ahead of time
184:48
with public money sharing risk
184:50
all the way from r d to developing the
184:52
manufacturing capability have ever warm
184:55
manufacturing facilities which you use
184:57
as best as you can in normal times
184:59
because you've got tv you've got malaria
185:01
you've got a whole
185:03
set of endemic diseases and you've got
185:05
to as best as you can use those
185:07
facilities to deal with endemic diseases
185:10
in order to then pivot
185:12
in a pandemic so
185:14
starting once a pandemic has broken out
185:16
you've got to try your very best
185:18
mobilize resources as best as you can
185:21
but even with those best efforts
185:24
it not only takes long but you allow
185:26
mutations to evolve and epidemic becomes
185:29
longer for everyone it's hugely costly
185:32
so just going back to the simple point
185:34
the cost of preparing in advance is
185:36
infinitesimal
185:38
compared to the cost of not preparing
185:40
that's the lesson of kovit and it
185:42
requires international collaboration and
185:44
the cost of collaboration is
185:45
infinitesimal compared to the cost of
185:47
not collaborating
185:49
on that note we'll leave the
185:51
conversation here
185:52
of course those lessons that we'll learn
185:55
through kovit and perhaps what we can do
185:56
next mr tharman thank you very much dan
185:59
elizabeth mr vice president it was great
186:02
having you at the
186:03
bloomberg economy forum thank you thank
186:05
you
186:17
[Music]
186:40
um
187:03
[Music]
187:08
[Music]
187:28
please welcome to the stage of moderator
187:30
john michael freight and 40th secretary
187:33
of commerce of the united states gina
187:35
raimondo
187:36
[Music]
187:46
thank you very much 40th secretary of
187:48
commerce makes it sort of adds a certain
187:50
amount to it um
187:52
we were going to discuss
187:54
two big things which have massive
187:56
interest everyone here
187:57
the first and both within your brief
188:01
come back to u.s competitiveness
188:03
generally in a bit but i thought we
188:05
might begin with trade
188:07
and you've been on a lightning tour
188:10
jet lag tour of asia with malaysia next
188:14
and you said in japan that you wanted to
188:16
form an economic framework that would be
188:19
even better than
188:20
cppt
188:24
or the comprehensive and progressive
188:25
agreement for trans-pacific partnership
188:27
and you said it'd be even more robust in
188:29
some ways than the traditional free
188:31
trade agreement and this is this
188:33
indo-pacific framework which america has
188:35
been talking about and i think many
188:37
of the business people here would say
188:39
look
188:40
we would rather have a trade pact that's
188:42
what we want
188:43
and i know that's difficult politically
188:45
but maybe you could spell out exactly
188:47
what this means and why it is better
188:49
yeah
188:50
so thank you it's good to be with you
188:52
and hello to everybody
188:54
i think that look i understand that you
188:56
know i began my week in tokyo i'm here
188:59
now i'll be heading off to malaysia i'm
189:02
meeting also
189:04
i'm here with my counterparts from new
189:06
zealand and australia and
189:08
we hear that we hear that you know cptpp
189:11
we want america in
189:14
here's what i would say um for various
189:17
reasons you know that is
189:20
not going to happen now
189:22
but the
189:24
president biden is crystal clear when he
189:26
says america is back he means back with
189:29
our allies and back in this region
189:32
so since he's been in office the vice
189:34
president has been in vietnam
189:36
secretary of defense has been here i am
189:38
here
189:39
ustr tai is here we are very
189:44
serious in re-engaging economically with
189:46
the indo-pacific
189:48
and when we talk about the topics it is
189:52
broader in some ways and a little bit
189:54
less restrained or constrained than a
189:56
traditional free trade agreement for
189:57
example
189:58
we can talk about partnerships around
190:00
the supply chain
190:02
specific
190:04
partnerships around working together to
190:06
make sure that we and our allies in the
190:08
region have a redundant and secure
190:10
supply chain you know australia has
190:13
critical minerals that we all need we
190:15
can talk
190:16
specifically and somewhat more flexibly
190:19
about partnerships
190:22
interoperability
190:25
which is critical to facilitate digital
190:27
trade
190:28
tech standards you know we were talking
190:30
backstage about artificial intelligence
190:32
you know you wouldn't see
190:33
setting tech standards in a traditional
190:35
free trade agreement but it is vital
190:37
who's going to write the rules of the
190:39
road for emerging technology we want to
190:41
write the rules of the road with
190:44
our like-minded allies in this region
190:46
semiconductors you know so i think that
190:50
um
190:51
decarbonization and green should we see
190:54
this as sort of the trade equivalent of
190:57
what people talked about at one time of
190:58
a kind of coalition of democracies this
191:00
is
191:01
america and its allies in asia getting
191:03
together in a in an economic way which
191:05
does not involve a specific trade pact
191:08
but which involves a series of kind of
191:10
complicated alliances building up to
191:12
that i think that's exactly that's that
191:14
is well said
191:16
and you know you can hire me if you want
191:18
to
191:18
i pro i'm sure i could not afford you
191:22
but
191:24
i think that is well said and you know
191:26
we i'm here in the region beginning the
191:27
discussions laying the groundwork
191:30
we're likely to launch you know a more
191:32
formal
191:33
process
191:35
in the beginning of next year which will
191:37
culminate in a proper economic framework
191:39
in the region
191:40
and does that mean an actual agreement
191:44
exactly exactly do you accept that part
191:46
of the cost of this is as you know china
191:49
and for that matter taiwan have both
191:51
applied to join the cptp
191:53
that that could be a consequence of it
191:55
that china becomes part of the trade
191:58
agreement that america left under donald
192:00
trump yeah
192:02
so i will
192:04
say this china is going to do what china
192:06
is going to do and whether or not the
192:09
the current members of cptpp allow china
192:12
to come in that will be as it will be
192:15
what i'm talking about is is is about
192:19
working with our allies in the region
192:22
allies we've had for decades in an
192:25
incredibly important and fast growing
192:27
region
192:28
you know in the indo-pacific
192:30
940 million people are entering the
192:33
middle class
192:34
in the next seven to ten years
192:36
you know it's
192:38
4.6 billion people some here in
192:40
singapore some of the best innovation
192:43
and
192:44
technology in the world so this isn't
192:47
about china this is about developing
192:50
robust commercial and economic
192:52
relationships with with our partners in
192:54
the indo-pacific where we have had
192:57
a robust relationship for a long time
192:58
but for the past few years i mean the
193:00
elephant in the room the reality is
193:03
america has been absent we have been
193:05
absent from the largely absent in the
193:08
past few years and when i am here in the
193:11
region
193:12
there seems to be a strong pull
193:15
to have us back and so we want to work
193:18
towards this agreement one last thing on
193:20
that i mean watching or listening to
193:23
wang shi-shan talking earlier it was
193:25
interesting to me how many times he
193:27
mentioned the word multilateral
193:28
multilateral multilateral
193:31
does it sort of worry at all that china
193:33
might be seen as
193:35
taking up the banner of multilateralism
193:36
whilst america is seen in this more a la
193:39
carte way
193:41
so again i
193:43
think that we just have to as i often
193:45
say we we have to kind of
193:48
run faster in america and play our game
193:50
in america we
193:52
we have our strategy
193:55
we are america is a fantastic and benign
193:59
and collaborative ally and partner
194:03
we have some of the best entrepreneurs
194:05
the deepest capital markets in the world
194:07
and a long history of working in this
194:08
region so we're going to do what we know
194:11
how to do and
194:13
you know china will do what it's going
194:15
to do
194:16
you mentioned international standards
194:18
and again just talking to henry
194:20
kissinger earlier that the all-important
194:22
issue
194:23
of artificial intelligence which also
194:25
goes into your brief on competitiveness
194:27
you know this is the industry of the
194:28
future
194:29
who is going to write the rules
194:31
of artificial intelligence and what do
194:33
you see as america's role in that so i
194:36
think this is an enormously important
194:38
topic
194:40
if you think about the internet
194:44
which of course was incredibly you know
194:46
powerful transformative disruptive it
194:48
primarily affected advertising in the
194:51
advertising market
194:53
and e-commerce you know retail
194:58
two relatively small pieces of our
195:01
economy
195:03
now you look at ai will change
195:07
fundamentally logistics biotechnology
195:12
health care
195:14
every single aspect of our economy
195:18
so i think that it's really impossible
195:21
to overestimate
195:23
the
195:25
you know what is coming in terms of
195:27
disruption transformation change and
195:29
progress
195:30
with respect to ai
195:33
which means first of all we have to get
195:36
it right in how we regulate
195:38
but secondly
195:40
we absolutely have to make sure
195:44
that like-minded partners who share
195:47
values around anti-discrimination
195:50
privacy
195:52
human rights
195:54
um
195:56
are together writing the rules of the
195:57
road so for example that's what i that's
195:59
part of what i'm talking about when i
196:01
sit down with malaysia when i sit
196:03
down with singapore i had a great
196:05
discussion yesterday with the tech
196:06
minister in singapore and exactly this
196:08
topic which is we have we share the same
196:11
values so we should be writing the rules
196:13
of the road we should be setting forth
196:15
the tech standards and governance models
196:18
for the appropriate
196:20
and safe use of ai are there
196:23
particular bits within that is there
196:25
particular sort of mini battlefields
196:27
within that yeah trying to set standards
196:29
in ai that you really want to focus on
196:32
so i would say this um
196:35
i think this has to be very use case
196:38
specific
196:40
so
196:40
ai as applied to
196:44
biotechnology will be different from ai
196:47
as applied to
196:48
logistics
196:52
and certainly there can be no room for
196:55
the use of ai
196:57
for you know surveillance or
197:00
um
197:01
[Music]
197:03
anything that pervades discrimination or
197:06
that kind of get you know gets into
197:08
ethical questions so it's it's an
197:10
enormously complex i think the trick the
197:14
trick is
197:15
use case specific industry specific
197:18
flexibility
197:20
right this is a this is an emerging
197:22
field we are in
197:24
the
197:24
i don't know a ton about sports so i
197:26
should be careful but you know like
197:27
second or third inning of ai so we have
197:30
to regulate and be be careful for the
197:32
dangers
197:33
but the potential is enormous so we have
197:36
to have some flexibility and sensible
197:38
regulations that we develop in
197:39
partnership with
197:41
industry and stakeholders and
197:44
our like-minded allies just that leads a
197:47
bit into the idea of american
197:48
competitiveness and i suppose
197:51
again many of the business people here
197:53
would would look at what's happening in
197:54
america
197:56
and they would see that there's been a
197:57
renewed focus and you've been at the
197:59
front of it in terms of sort of focusing
198:00
on industries focusing on different
198:04
um parts of the american economy to push
198:05
forward but they would also say look a
198:08
lot of biden's bills also involve things
198:10
like giving jobs to americans
198:13
unions all those things which is
198:15
precisely what goes down badly
198:18
in the rest of the world
198:20
is there an element that america first
198:23
harms america's attempts to help the
198:26
other side of your brief the trade brief
198:28
yeah
198:29
so like everything it's a balance you
198:32
know president biden is as you say
198:34
extremely focused on creating good
198:37
quality jobs in america
198:39
and good
198:40
emphasis on quality right decent pay
198:43
decent benefits decent working
198:44
conditions
198:45
having said that we are equally focused
198:49
on
198:51
kind of re-strengthening our
198:53
relationships with our allies
198:55
in in europe
198:56
uh in the indo-pacific and around the
198:58
world and i think that
199:01
you know we talk about onshore
199:04
but we're also talking about uh
199:06
friendshiring
199:08
it isn't realistic take semiconductors
199:10
it is a global complex supply chain
199:13
i'll be going to malaysia tomorrow
199:15
visiting advanced manufacturing
199:17
facilities and semiconductor facilities
199:20
that won't change
199:21
right and that is
199:24
that is that is okay that is a good
199:25
thing we don't think that everything can
199:27
be domestically produced
199:29
so we want to work with our allies and
199:32
and friend sure but yes of course we
199:35
also
199:36
want to enhance domestic supply of
199:39
uh semiconductor chips do you think do
199:42
you think the nature of the
199:43
debate about competitiveness has changed
199:46
partly because of what's happening with
199:47
china but also
199:49
partly because of covid it has made
199:51
countries think
199:53
countries that used to espouse what
199:55
might be broadly described as kind of
199:57
free market principles it's made them
199:59
think much harder about what industries
200:01
they need to keep at home yeah
200:04
absolutely absolutely you know
200:06
semiconductors is the best example
200:09
there's a global shortage of
200:10
semiconductors i was at a
200:12
ceo roundtable earlier of a variety of
200:15
different companies and they were all
200:18
saying
200:19
we can't get our hands on enough chips
200:21
so there's a you know
200:23
global demand is vastly outstrip global
200:26
supply in the united the united states
200:30
effectively and you know
200:32
invented or the semiconductor industry
200:34
was born in the us
200:36
and we in search of cheap labor overseas
200:39
we've watched that dwindle we now make
200:42
you know zero
200:44
percent of the world's most
200:45
sophisticated chips in america we only
200:47
make uh 12 or 13 percent of global
200:49
supply a couple decades ago we made 40
200:51
percent
200:52
so we absolutely need to increase
200:55
domestic supply
200:57
by the way not necessarily just by
200:58
american companies
201:00
you know like we have there are
201:02
companies in japan and
201:05
korea and taiwan which
201:08
which we hope will set up shop in
201:10
america and have domestic production
201:12
but at the same time
201:15
we do need to collaborate even in a
201:18
tighter way with our allies i mean these
201:21
global supply chains are by their name
201:24
which are global
201:25
um
201:26
and we have to shore up those
201:27
partnerships and it's about it's about
201:29
the supplies as well like critical
201:31
minerals minerals for batteries you know
201:34
minerals for semiconductors so it's
201:37
you know complex you can imagine
201:39
somebody though from an american
201:41
perspective saying look at you know
201:44
the the administration has come in
201:46
talking about the need to build a bigger
201:48
technology
201:49
industry but you're also the people who
201:51
are pushing anti-trust policy which i
201:53
know is not yours towards the big tech
201:55
giants
201:56
you see a lot of people here from from
201:58
from big banks and so on you look at
202:00
wall street it's another
202:02
massive area of
202:04
american competitive strength and yet
202:06
there's definitely some desire to reign
202:08
in wall street in the in the in the
202:09
biden administration
202:11
how do you sort of from somebody who's
202:13
trying to sell u.s competitiveness but
202:15
also bring the democratic party with you
202:17
how do you do that
202:19
i think it is really quite consistent
202:21
which is to say we're pro competition
202:23
[Music]
202:25
competition has what is what has
202:27
formed
202:29
the basis of such a successful
202:31
innovative and vibrant economy and so
202:36
whether it's big tech or any other you
202:38
know big company if they if
202:40
if there are anti-competitive
202:43
factors at play that hurts competition
202:46
that hurts startups that that snuffs out
202:49
innovation
202:51
the american capital markets are as you
202:53
say robust and liquid
202:56
and that that is a good thing right
202:59
america is still
203:01
the best place to start a business
203:04
you don't see a kind of contradiction
203:06
between i suppose the progressive wing
203:07
of the democratic party and your job to
203:09
the extent that there is i suppose
203:11
considerable
203:13
anger with capitalism and various sorts
203:15
of it on one part of the democratic
203:17
party and you on the other hand are
203:18
trying to boost
203:20
american business i would say this
203:23
it is
203:24
true
203:25
i am and president biden is you know
203:29
self-proclaimed capitalist and
203:30
self-proclaimed pro-business we want to
203:33
have policies which encourage innovation
203:36
and business growth and
203:38
and that is important having said that
203:41
look the excesses of capitalism
203:46
are on full display in america they have
203:47
led to a lack of competition
203:50
a concentration of wealth at the top
203:53
which is threatening
203:54
to our democracy and to capitalism
203:57
itself
203:59
so i don't i don't actually see
204:02
the tension i think
204:05
i actually think we cannot continue to
204:07
have a vibrant democracy or
204:10
entrepreneurial scene with this
204:12
concentration of power or wealth and so
204:15
i think it's healthy actually
204:18
i think you can be both you know i think
204:19
you can be both that you have to move
204:21
towards a more
204:23
inclusive
204:25
equal
204:28
form of capitalism
204:30
where businesses are successful but
204:32
workers are also successful you talked
204:34
about the excess of capitalism and one
204:36
very obvious area is the environment you
204:38
know we had copped last week
204:41
do you see that as america setting off
204:43
on a new
204:45
in a new way when it comes to to the
204:47
environment you heard mike earlier talk
204:48
about the necessity of getting rid of
204:50
coal and things like that is that part
204:52
of your vision is your how green is your
204:55
vision of american
204:57
the newly competitive america your your
205:00
building
205:01
they're very green totally green
205:03
[Music]
205:05
and in that regard a huge opportunities
205:08
for job creation for innovation and for
205:10
collaboration with our partners in in
205:13
the indo-pacific so
205:15
look the reality is we will not be able
205:18
to achieve
205:20
the goals that we all want to in need to
205:22
as it relates to deca
205:24
urbanization without more innovation
205:27
like scientists will tell you
205:29
25 of the goal will be achieved
205:33
by technology that is that doesn't exist
205:36
so that means you know
205:38
venture capital entrepreneurs innovation
205:41
research and development
205:43
bigger investments in research and
205:45
development um
205:47
are critical you know we just the
205:49
president just signed the trillion
205:50
dollar infrastructure package in that
205:52
package is the biggest climate
205:54
investment ever in the history of the
205:55
united states huge investments for
205:58
electric vehicle charging stations tax
206:00
incentives to innovate so
206:03
uh i
206:05
think there's a lot of innovation going
206:06
on in this region so i think very green
206:08
but i think if we do it right it will it
206:11
will create millions of jobs and the
206:14
challenge is that we have to bring
206:16
everybody along i mean the reality is if
206:18
you're in a coal affected community when
206:20
you hear climate change you get nervous
206:22
you hear i'm losing my job
206:25
so it's on us to have a just transition
206:27
and make sure that everybody's included
206:29
putting on you used to be a governor
206:30
famously but putting on that hat how
206:33
difficult is it to sell greenery on the
206:35
doorstep it can be difficult and i don't
206:38
think we i think we should be
206:40
real about the challenges it is
206:43
necessary and
206:45
we have to move forward
206:46
aggressively and and you know as
206:48
robustly as possible
206:50
but if you live in west virginia or
206:52
kentucky or ohio pennsylvania and it is
206:55
the only way you and your finger a third
206:58
or fourth or fifth generation coal
206:59
family
207:01
it can be difficult and i think that we
207:03
have to
207:03
[Music]
207:05
those concerns are valid you know i was
207:07
the governor of rhode island not a coal
207:09
community but a manufacturing community
207:12
and when i talked about tech
207:14
that made people a little nervous they
207:16
wanted old line manufacturing and so i
207:19
think if we will be successful in
207:21
bringing people along you have to be
207:23
real about the
207:24
challenge but also meet the needs you
207:26
know provide jobs ride new jobs write
207:28
job training
207:30
one last thing is that you know you as
207:31
you said you were a governor now you've
207:32
entered this horrific world of cabinets
207:35
and things where you're
207:36
part of it what's the biggest change in
207:38
that i mean you were always seen as one
207:40
of the great pragmatists of the
207:41
democratic party yeah once it actually
207:43
comes to
207:45
working in administration how different
207:46
is that
207:48
you know i'd like to think i still am a
207:49
great pragmatist a couple of weeks ago i
207:51
was able to resolve the 232 steel and
207:54
aluminum tariffs with the with the
207:56
europeans
207:58
i'm here you know practically looking to
208:01
kind of
208:04
make deals and and make things happen on
208:06
the supply chain issues i'm in the
208:08
middle talking to businesses so i'm
208:11
so far finding it to be
208:14
a place in this administration and the
208:16
president encourages this get things
208:18
done you know i'm not one for the
208:21
high-minded jargon like let's get
208:24
things done and uh so far i've been able
208:26
to find my spots to do that with
208:28
slightly more jet lag um
208:29
quite a bit more jet lag
208:31
secretary thank you very much for
208:33
talking to us thank you
208:38
[Applause]
208:49
please welcome to the stage andrew brown
208:54
[Music]
209:06
sorry um before you go uh thank you john
209:09
thank yo
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